Kansas City Chiefs kicker Harrison Butker has landed in hot water over comments he made on Pride month, Catholicism, and women’s roles in society during a recent commencement speech at Benedictine College.
Butker, a 3-time Super Bowl winner, called out “dangerous gender ideology” and referred to Pride Month as an example of the "deadly sins" while seemingly advocating for a more conservative brand of Catholicism.
His address to students at the Catholic school in Atchison, Kansas left some fellow Catholics cheering – and critics outraged.
Dividing Lines
Butker’s speech laid out a vision for a stricter version of Catholicism and a stronger church community that rejects “degenerate cultural values and media.”
Speaking on the concept of pride, Butker clarified: “Not the deadly sins sort of Pride that has an entire month dedicated to it, but the true God-centered pride that is cooperating with the holy ghost to glorify him."
He also took issue with popular opinions on abortion, LGBTQ+ rights, and the roles of women that don’t align with Catholic teachings.
Some fellow Catholics called his speech brave and a “must watch.”
The group CatholicVote called it “powerful”:
However, critics were equally dismayed. Some accused Butker of “weaponizing his faith” and “twisting Jesus’s message”:
Even local leaders in Kansas City – the town where Butker helped deliver three championships – called him out for the comments.
But his opposition to Pride wasn’t the only thing critics took issue with.
Shoud More Women Aspire to Be Homemakers?
The address is also generating attention for its attitude toward gender roles. Butker insisted that women have been lied to by society and that arguably the most important title they can hold is "homemaker."
"It is you, the women, who have had the most diabolic lies told to you. Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world but I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world," Butker said.
Critics were quick to compare this situation to controversy set off by former NFL player Colin Kaepernick when he refused to stand during the national anthem.
Other women were offended by the notion that they were supposed to choose between being a mother and having a career:
It's worth noting that Butker's mother, Elizabeth Keller Butker, is an accomplished physicist and a published author. She currently works at Emory University's Department of Radiation Oncology.
[UPDATE 5/21/24]: The Benedictine College nuns released a statement denouncing Butker's comments. It reads, in part:
"The sisters of Mount St. Scholastica do not believe that Harrison Butker's comments in his 2024 Benedictine College commencement address represent the Catholic, Benedictine, liberal arts college that our founders envisioned and in which we have been so invested. Instead of promoting unity in our church, our nation, and the world, his comments seem to have fostered division."
"One of our concerns was the assertion that being a homemaker is the highest calling for a woman. We sisters have dedicated our lives to God and God's people, including the many women whom we have taught and influenced during the past 160 years. These women have made a tremendous difference in the world in their roles as wives and mothers and through their God-given gifts in leadership, scholarship, and their careers."
Are Strict Religious Rules Part of a “Bygone Era?”
Speaking about the school itself, Butker specifically called out an Associated Press article highlighting some strict rules Benedictine College has, including "volunteering for 3 a.m. prayers" and "pornography, premarital sex and sunbathing in swimsuits being forbidden." The article called these “precepts of a bygone era.”
Butker disagreed, saying that the story was an "attempt to rebuke and embarrass" places like Benedictine, and that it should be met with "pride" instead of "anger."
He also called on religious leaders "to stay in their lane and lead," and praised Benedictine for embracing what he called traditional Catholic values. "When you embrace tradition, success, worldly and spiritual, will follow," Butker said.
Clearly, many critics disagree with this perspective – they view such ideas as a regressive move backward, not a positive vision for the future.
What is your reaction? Is Butker simply voicing the beliefs of many Catholics, or was he out of line with these comments?
219 comments
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Bond Wright
The Benedictine Nuns got all over his case for those statements.
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Russel A. Kester
And they were simply wrong.
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Robert Edgar Lamoureux
My beloved grandmother had always led a life and as an example of a catholic and good human. She volunteered to work for the church that was her community and family, was nonjudgmental, cared for all, hated no one, and set an example by her actions for her four children, eight grandchildren and ( I lost count) great-grandchildren all while living through a Great Depression, World War, working and living the good and bad of life. I have never heard her claim "Jesus/god hates ______" or anything similar. I truly feel, nay, KNOW that if no religion was ever created, she would still have been the warm, caring and good human she was her whole rich and celebrated life. It was her example that set my moral compass. That said, she was a football fan and would would have suggested that Harrison could stuff his opinion in his Butker.
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Melaine Rae Thompson
I listened to the clips and all I got was: A- he doesn’t like President Biden, B- he is still irritated about the Covid lockdown and C- you should be kind to everyone unless they don’t agree with your version of Christianity. As for women staying home and being wives and mothers, good luck being able to afford to do that.
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Russel A. Kester
Melanie, that's the problem with clips anything can be taken out of context and made to sounds anyway the editor wants it to sound. I encourage you to listen to the entire speech or to read it. Context is everything..
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Melaine Rae Thompson
I pulled up and listened to the whole 20+ minute speech and I personally believe it is worse than the clips make it out.
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Rev. Rory
People have a right in this country to follow their faith or follow none. That's what a pluralistic society is - a variety of people. The rule of law is supposed to be for all of us to have freedom and not be subject to a particular faith inserted into the law while at the same time protecting us from those that would inflict harm. So if a football player wants to tell Catholic school graduates his interpretation of their religion, fine. I assume that any speaker at that school would do the same. It's only because he is a known person that his remarks came to light. So Catholic women, go ahead and be homemakers and serve a husband if you think that is your calling. We can respect your decision but leave the rest of us alone. People are not "evil" if they do not subscribe to your world view. "We are all children of the same universe."
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Bond Wright
People like him drive me toward natural Radical Feminism.
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Daniel Todd Kamm
"When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." - Maya Angelou
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CJC
It doesn't affect me personally so I don't care. No reason for me to get Internet outraged and be a keyboard warrior like so many. He has as much right as anyone to say what they want in that situation. People often forget there are people in this world that don't share their same opinions. Too much cancel culture going on. It cuts both ways.
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Gary Stephen Lowden
Butker made a conservative, reactionary speech at a conservative Catholic university. If that's what he wants to believe, so be it. However, the Christian right attacks anyone who thinks differently. Yet when by
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Rev Ned
Butker is a football player after all. So his cognitive abilities are probably diminished from too many concussions. Unless of course, he really is intellectually impaired, which could also explain his behavior. Either way, he should be pitied and prayed for.
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Gerard Anthony Ritchie
Apparently his Mom, Elizabeth Butker, has been a medical physicist at Emory University since 1988 and according to the university website was inspired by her father's career so she joined in 1988 where she specializes in brachytherapy and Gamma Knife medical physics care. I don't know exactly what those medical fields are but I am sure you need to be well educated and have significant professional experience before you could be considered as a specialist. And she has been doing it since 1988 so, presumably, managed to have a professional career and bring up little Harrison at the same time. It's interesting, however, that little Harrison didn't manage to accomplish the same level of accademic success as his Mom and Grandfather. Maybe, that's his problem. Maybe just being a sports jock with a limited professional career is a pretty poor comparison to his Mom. Maybe he can't stand the competition from bright successful women. I'm getting a Handmaid's Tale vibe about him. Boy would I love to be a fly on the wall listening in to some therapy sessions with 'masculine' Harrison being asked about his Mommy issues. Although, in the real world he would no doubt be too terrified to go anywhere near a therapist to explore that. Pandoras Box!
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PiratePreacher
This guy represents patriarchal scum bags everywhere and should not be allowed to speak publicly again. This is nothing if not the American Taliban rhetoric. I am not ready for a burqa people, and these ideas are dangerous. Remember that women were respected, well educated and free to live how they wished in Iran and Afghanistan 60 years ago.
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Russel A. Kester
Pirate, you decry how the Taliban denies women their free speech while calling for the cancellation of Butker. Seems rather Taliban like behavior to me. Why would one find Butker's ideas dangerous? And if they were dangerous wouldn't one want to expose that danger with devastatingly well reasoned responses that explicitly draw out where the danger lies in his ideas instead of calling for no one being allowed to even hear them?
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Robert Edgar Lamoureux
I do not feel that Pirate's opinion limiting Buttker's free speech is a good idea, however Harrison's words are, in fact, dangerous. We have seen in several instances (Comet Ping Pong, tormenting Sandy Hook's victims families) where someone could have died. We have seen over-and-over again how attempting to do the same work we do tell their audience how "God will punish... " "Jesus hates...." "Allah tells us...." and such nonsense. Those and similar words have lead to violence and deaths. I also would mention, to Pirate, who would force you to wear....well anything? Why are we afraid of Sharia law and it's restriction but allow "conservative" politicians to create into law, restrictions for anyone's way of life, access to medical care, sexual orientation, or expression of those. We are allowing a "Christian" version of Sharia law and that should be anywhere, particularly in a country that brags about our freedoms.
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Robert James Ruhnke
Kester, people are already doing that. Your head is buried firmly in the sand. The Nuns of Benedictine have already given a well reasoned response. Go and look it up.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, the monk's opinions have not been published to my knowledge and neither has the Catholic hierarchy's. Until then, a few disgruntled nuns are of no consequence. However, the nuns opinions does indicate that the two orders should not have combined their respective single sex colleges into one coed college. It was a mistake, but doing so was popular at the time.
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Stoodie Baker
So many whiney, self important, armchair warriors on these threads. "Oh my gosh and golly! A man has an opinion that I don't agree with! I will go online and whine and cry about it and get confirmation bias from people that think just like me!" You people are pathetic. Go outside and touch some grass and quit worrying about what everyone else is doing and focus on yourselves. My god, the endless Trump rants and anti-Christian rants from you folk. SMH, I really hope you all get some much needed therapy. Be the change you want to see.
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Donald G Magel
Since the Evangelicals have selected rump as their chosen one then this Butker guy should be number 2 on their "Isn't he just darling" list.
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James S Weaver Jr
I always have to shake my head in wonder and sadness that “modern man/woman” still finds it necessary to adhere to a social and moral code espoused by nomadic sheep herders who’s frame of reference was entirely patriarchal. What those people didn’t know about biology, psychology, genetics and the world in general would fill all the book shelves in at library in Alexandria. The Old Testament is full of hate, violence, betrayal, and overarching inconsistency. Conservatives live to cherry pick passages from Leviticus or Genesis, while ignoring all the passages that contradict their rigid belief system. They also ignore that Jesus created a whole new ballgame so to speak in which the two primary directives were to love God and love your neighbors. I haven’t read of any exceptions. Also, homosexuality was not uncommon in the ancient world, nor was it unusual for a woman to visit a wise woman for a cup of “tea” if their periods ran late; and yet Jesus never mentioned either of those. As for the role of women, Jesus’ ministry was largely funded by wealthy women. Conservative religious groups of all faiths wish to preserve the status quote of Patriarchy and power, so that requires them to repress the roles of women and minorities. Butthead is just another cig in their wheel.
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Rev Samantha Counihan
hes out of line, hateful, and hes sexist towards all of us women cis and trans
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Keith Law
How does it happen that people with such primitive ideology get invited to speak anywhere?
Let’s get this straight, he believes there is an invisible magic man in the sky who 2000 years ago impregnated a Jewish women, just before her wedding to someone else, and their demigod baby somehow tells him that over 1/2 the worlds population has to be in service to men like him, so he can kick a ball for millions of dollars. Oh, and the demigod gets to determine what is proper sexual conduct among consenting adults too.
What century is this?
This is the Republican Party agenda, so please don’t vote for any of them ever again.
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Miriam Gates
He has a right to his opinion! PERIOD! There was nothing wrong at all with what he SUGGESTED! Again all offended humans think these graduates can’t think for themselves. Offended humans, why are they offended?
Children want their parents at home when they are babies, don’t want to be raised in daycare or by Nannie’s etc… they want parents are their games, pick them up when they are sick, or have school activities, when they are bullied at school…. Picking them up from school…. Sadly humans are led to believe they can do it all… yes they can but not as effective as being able to focus on home life …. Child ask parent can you come to my event or will you be at my game etc… answer. I have work, have to travel for my career, BUT a representative for parents will be there…. Children are EXPECTED to be so understanding of parents absence because parent can do it all!!!!!
There again this reality like it or not and if you choose to be offended go look in the mirror and be offended at the face in the mirror!
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Paul Edward Nunis
Perhaps he didn't get the memo from the Pope... and from Jesus.
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Veronica
Interestingly, Russel, it seems that when we defend 'freedom of speech' it seems to be only when we have similar beliefs. So we support and cheer for that person. But when we don't have those same beliefs, we think people need to keep their thoughts to themselves. It's a very human situation. I could go on about Pride month and how important it is for the LGBTQ+ community and there's folks here who would want me to stop talking. Unless someone has done some long, hard work on themselves, it's an almost instinctive reaction. So maybe consider those folks are reacting strongly because the 'freedom' taken by this man to spread unloving words isn't how they want to live, and it hurts the spirit hear things like that glorified. Jesus and the Bible absolutely did not spread hate. Absolutely did not condemn. So if that is the catalyst for this man's beliefs, it also adds to the anger, that ince again religion is being used to verbally assault people, and they aren't even actually using what Jesus taught. I wish you an open mind in reading this, and a beautiful day.
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Russel A. Kester
Veronica, nice comment. I did read it with an open mind. Hopefully, we will all improve in our efforts to be free speech advocates; especially when we despise what is said.
While I agreed with the thought that there is no higher calling than parenthood, I was uncertain what he was objecting to about pride month. With so many different types of people thrown in together with those letters it's hard to know, but I suspect he meant everyone. And in that he may well be very wrong. I would like to find a video of the entire speech to hear it in its full context. Until then, I'm withholding judgement with prejudice (the legal idea). I think Jesus did condemn the scribes and Pharisees. I asked Google AI to confirm my memory of Jesus having done so is correct ,and it replied, "Yes, Jesus compares the Pharisees to vipers in the Gospel of Matthew, calling them "a generation of vipers" in Matthew 23:33. Jesus also says, "Ye serpents, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?" in Matthew 23:33. In Matthew 12:33–37, Jesus compares the Pharisees to vipers, associating them with evil and the Devil. Jesus says that their actions, including their speech, show their inner heart, and that they are like a diseased tree that produces bad fruit."
I didn't get the sense that Butker was speaking from a place of anger or animosity, but his sincerely held beliefs which were in accordance with Roman Catholic doctrine as I understand them. Though it sounded as if his comment about Pride Month failed to reflect the love and dignity a Christian should show to all persons.
I was so glad to read your comments to me, and I wish you too a beautiful day.
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Bond Wright
Eliminating Jews was not coming from a place of anger or animosity, but their sincerely held beliefs which were in accordance with the Third Reich doctrine, as I understand them.
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Russel A. Kester
Bond, I listened to and read his entire speech and no where did he say to eliminate the Jews. In fact, in the US it is Christians who are standing up for Israel against far-left woke adversaries. There is a controversy in our country where some want to pass a law criminalizing one who says that the Jews killed Jesus and Butker, as a traditional Catholic, would be against any such law on the basis that the New Testament makes specific references to that and that it violates free speech. Both are correct. But that is not the same as saying that the Jews should be eliminated. You're thinking of Hamas and Islamists not Christians like Butker.
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Ronaldo
Whether or not a woman has a good career, or a man does, the most important question to ask is "who is raising the children?" Is it a parent with a vested interest in their development, or minimum wage childcare professionals who see it as just a job? There is a lot of evidence that children actually raised by their parents tend to turn out to be better citizens, unless those parents can afford high-priced care and/or private boarding schools.
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William Lewis Vass
I think that most of the comments are just as preposterous as the words of an idiot who sparked these comments. Thats all I have to say about that.
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Rev Morse
I grew up marrying a pastors son when I was very young and had 5 children and that was my role, a homemaker. He never lifted a finger and couldn't really support us all. He expected everything perfect. And me to be his slave. I ended up getting granted a divorce by the church on the grounds of him cheating and impregnated another woman. This has never helped my family in the long run. Youngest child is 14 now. And I still stay at home, besides some dog walking jobs.
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Russel A. Kester
Rev Morse, I was very saddened to read what happened to you and your marriage. Your children were blessed that you loved them and took care of them so well. It is a sad commentary that there are too many stories like yours. Men must keep their marriage vows and be good husbands and fathers. The failure was his. Another example of how the sins of the father were visited upon his children (and wife).
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Jimmy Moon
I see Satan's minions are out in full force. Doesn't Harrison Butker have the right to express his ideas for a better future for America? He was invited to speak. He didn't ask to speak. It was a magnificent speech. The alphabet people don't run this country just yet. There are still people out there ready to step up and call sin, sin. Keep your panties from wadding up if you can. Call me homophobe if you like. I can handle it.
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Steven Ferrell
What is so terrible about a woman being a homemakers? That is one very hard job, much harder than any corporate job or job outside the home.
My wife was a homemaker until our youngest started HS before she went to work full time someplace.
The job she did was nothing short of AMAZING.
How about women stop putting women down who choose to be a homemaker, since obviously they don’t have what it takes to do that hard of a job.-
Thomas P. Davis
Amen and Amen, being a wife and a mother is probably the most important job on the planet. Then some minority came along and tried to take that title away. My sister-in-law and mother-in-law were constantly trying to tell my wife that there was no self-worth in staying at home and raising children. That she needed to get a real job and be someone. Thankfully she followed her heart and stayed at home until the kids were in high school then got a part time job to help pay the bills.
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Patricia Ann Gross
I don't think anyone is. I agree totally. Even the nuns at the College were concerned with his speach because they have not given their life to "homemaking," and feel that they are doing what is the highest calling that God has given them. The issue is with choice, and he disparaged career women in front of a crowd of women who just spent years of their young lives and $100K+ to receive degrees to do that. Most commencement speaches congratulate the graduates, and give insparation for them to go out and make a difference in the world. That difference can be a career like his mother had, or raising a family of children to do the same.
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Russel A. Kester
No, Patricia, even the vocational calling to the priesthood or religious orders is not higher than that of being a parent. And no job in the world can ever be thought of as equal to let alone higher than that of being a parent. Parenthood is the highest calling God can give to we humans bar none.
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Patricia Ann Gross
I respectfully disagree. The highest calling one can have is the one that God has called you to. If that is homemaker/parenthood, then that is the highest calling for you. To call homemaker/parenthood the "highest calling God can give to we humans bar none," disparages every other profession. If everyone were a [any given profession] then that would be a sad world to live in. Who would do all the other work? God gave us each gifts and graces and expects us to use them to make this world a better place.
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Russel A. Kester
Patricia, I think I see what you're saying. And I would agree that following God's chosen vocation for any individual is the highest and best for that person, but as a society the begetting of children and being a truly good parent gets the top award. The Jewish faith certainly thought so as reflected in the words to be fruitful and multiply. And societies throughout history have shown similar thoughts. But you are correct that not everyone is called to be a parent, and they shouldn't be looked down on for not having children. But instead everyone should be praised for acknowledging and following his or her vocation. In that sense we are all equally called to our vocations. Your comments made me really reflect on my thoughts. I hope I did justice to your comment.
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Lee Elman
As a minister to all. We must treat peoples words as their own. It is not a speech of hate but one of faith. His. How he prays is his business, how he speaks gospel is his business. He was asked to speak at a college. He did. People are upset that a Football player speaks his mind. Can we discuss other athletes and what hey do or musicians. Stop blaming the man who shares his thoughts in the open. He has faith and beliefs. Let him have them. You do not have to like him but never silence someone.
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David M Hines
Here's the part of Butker's speech that really made my jaw drop:
"stating something as basic as the biblical teaching of who killed Jesus"
You DO know who he's talking about, yes? And which dogs he's whistling to?
Don’t take my word for it. The speech is online - read it for yourself.
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PiratePreacher
Agreed. It was pretty gross.
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Michael Howard Schrader
If you read the transcript, it is much worse than the excerpts. He insults Joe Biden, DEI, Taylor Swift, the Pope, victims of clerical abuse, women who don't want to get married, non-parents, non-manly men, the LBGTQ community, single people of both genders, and people who use birth control, including those who use the Catholic Church's natural family planning method, and the media. He also shows his anti-Semitism with his remark that Congress banned teaching about who killed Jesus and how he died. He is 28, not much older than most of the graduates, and his entire speech is lecturing people his own age and touting his own experience and greatness. Just a horrible speech, and the Chiefs and the Catholic defenders are completely okay with the hate he spewed.
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Russel A. Kester
Michael, you totally mischaracterized his speech! It was a total butcher job. But no one need take my word for it. Here is a transcript of his entire speech:
https://www.ncregister.com/news/harrison-butker-speech-at-benedictine
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Robert James Ruhnke
When you stop paying attention to where the words are coming from, and pay attention to what he’s saying, you’ll see his honey’d venomed for what it is. If I have to translate for you, I shall.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, if there is any venomous intent here, I don't think Mr. Butker is the guilty party.
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Robert James Ruhnke
The nuns of Benedictine disagree with your view of your statement. They too saw his speech as divisive and venomous.
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Russel A. Kester
Evidently, the brothers of the Benedictine order didn't think so and neither did the school's top officials who were right there. The local bishop didn't say Butker was wrong and neither did the Pope. So, you choose to listen to a few disgruntled nuns and none of the brothers and church hierarchy. Typical.
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Robert James Ruhnke
And you only focus on what men say, typical misogynistic chauvinist. Reducing nuns to disgruntled as a means of undermining and gaslighting what they’re saying.
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Daniel Gray
I love it how some people try and use wikipedia as their source when even wikipedia says that they shouldnt as it can be changed at any time for any reason depending on the persons editing it's beliefs and thought process
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_is_not_a_reliable_source_for_citations_elsewhere_on_Wikipedia
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Michael Hunt
Right, you don't use Wikipedia as a source, you use the citations in the Wikipedia article as your source. That way you know you're getting the correct information from the original source.
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Rev. Michael Gerraghty II
And they wonder WHY church attendance is taking a nose dive and people are converting to Pagan religions??
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
generally speaking, why would anyone care what a football player thinks, must less his 'views' on religion. I really wish the medical profession could get together on an accurate diagnosis for religiosity. there's no doubt religion is based on severe mental issues based mostly on the egregious brain damage done to them by their family as infants and children. forcing children to participate in religion is tantamount to brain washing and child abuse. this country really needs to rise up and fight against the forces that punish children through religious fantasy and horror stories. let's end religion once and for all
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Danny D. Maynard
Face it, one's chosen brand of religion is usually forced on a person when each was a child by the parents and grandparents. It is a result of where one is raised and by whom, thus a result of geography.
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Daniel Gray
Wrong yet again Danny. You have people who are not religious who have joined religions and verse visa. You have people who were raised one religion and converted to a different one. So your claim make absolutely no sense.
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Danny D. Maynard
My conversion to Atheism happened because I see religion for what it truly is ... a way to c have control over the flock and take their possessions. Your "faith" and those "religious feelings"' happen to all people who are deeply in a cult. You have been had. There are no supernatural gods and there is no afterlife as being waved in front of you and your flock.
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Daniel Gray
Ok then why did you say that a religion is placed on you by your parents? Didnt you just say you converted from a religion to a non believer?
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Daniel Gray
Ok then WHY are you here and have the term Rev in front of your name if you believe religion is a mental issue. Does not say much about you now does it?
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Once again hate speech from a Catholic. When can Christians be declared a hate group?
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Rev. Michael Gerraghty II
Already are, No hate like Christian love is a trending phrase lately with various forms of evidence.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
No ... I want them listed on the official Government hate group list.
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PiratePreacher
They should be really. Its Taliban level stuff
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Russel A. Kester
Matthew, the speech was not a hate speech and Christians are not a hate group. People with beliefs that differ from yours doesn't make them hateful. They have a right to their beliefs, to practice their beliefs, and even to advocate for their beliefs.
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Robert James Ruhnke
Their beliefs dictate that they can force others to their will and way of thinking. He’s talking about Right Wing Christians, not all Christians. His speech was laced with hate fueled talking points the right constantly try to push on others.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, I not only listened to his speech, I also read the transcript. There were no hate fueled talking points. He was actually quite humble. Since he is clearly a traditional Catholic, there are things I disagree with in his beliefs. But I separate those from the man.
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James Riggle-Johnson
I wonder where Harrison Butker stands on the Catholic Church that allowed thousands of priests who molested children and then protected them, hid them, transferred them somewhere else to continue their dirty deeds? He doesn’t seem to mention that. How does that fit into his list of where the church should be? I wonder if that fits into the God-centered pride he talks about? Apparently, Mom’s working and gay people existing is far worse than what the church has and probably continues to do. Just my two cents.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
James ... The religious right don't want to inhibit, in any way shape or form, non-LBGTQ white men.
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ServantOfJudgement
A priest that molests a boy is gay. Not that all gay dudes molest boys by any stretch, but those ones do.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
soj, the research on this topic is clear and well documented. A priest who molests an under age boy is NOT gay, he is a pedophile. These are two different things. One is an innate, social and psychological characteristic that naturally occurs in (x)% of the population and the other is a criminal psychopathology. Not understanding that point seems to shed light on your depth of understanding of this issue.
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Russel A. Kester
Klaire, that was well said. One must give credit where credit is due.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Servant, you obviously don't understand the meaning of pedophilia. There are no gay or straight pedophiles. Their sexual preference is children. Some molest both sexes.
Gay men aren't pedophiles. Pedophiles are pedophiles. Catholic priests are mandated to be celibate. They aren't married. So, they are not only adulterers, they've broken their priestly vows by not remaining chaste and then they're rapists by being pedophiles. The church enables this. They don't defrock them, they don't turn them in to the police, they don't even cloister them; they send them to a new parish to provide them with new hunting grounds.-
Thomas P. Davis
You are also leaving out their relationships with the nuns, especially the cloistered nuns.
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PiratePreacher
You apparently have no idea how paedophaelia works bro. Gay people are not paedos. Stop being hateful
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Rev. MichaelRS
Just to address one point;
There are MANY specific sins that in the records of Jesus's teaching he did not talk about. That does not mean that those things are/were no longer sins.
Over the years there has been this false teaching that Christians are are called upon to be tolerant, forgiving and loving to the point of permissiveness and ignoring sin.
But how can one come out of sin if they can't recognize it for what it is?
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ServantOfJudgement
You mean it's still a sin to kill kittens for fun even though Jesus didn't say anything about killing kittens for fun?
You nailed the biggest cherry picking problem/practice I've ever seen.
You've got to read the entire document if you want to know what Jesus thinks about things humans talk about and do.
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William Harrison Anderson
I think ol' Harrison Butker plays football without a hemet.
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ServantOfJudgement
The man spoke his catholic values at a Catholic school. Hopefully he does not apologize.
Planned parenthood and it's preists speak their values in public on TV and on billboards. Why can't a Catholic in a Catholic school?
The woke hive mind and it's drones speak their values in public, on TV and on billboards why can't a Catholic in a Catholic school?
On and on.
He's speaking to his fellow Catholics in a Catholic school. I'm not Catholic, he's not talking to me although he's right with what he said.
Jesus was again on the money, the antichrists will judge christians in hypocrisy.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
I guess you've kind of "nailed it"! He spoke his catholic values at a catholic school! What could be worse!?!
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ServantOfJudgement
Dunno, seems like a disproportionate amount of NFL stars are arrested annually. People might not agree with the guy's angle but at least he's not slapping is baby mamma around or pulling guns on people. Not yet anyway.
Might be a better role model than the usual ones we see in the news.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Hey Servant ... why not pass judgement on the bible salesman, who paid hush money to a prostitute?
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ServantOfJudgement
Interestingly Matthew, I found in the new testament christians may indeed critique Christians for the purpose of course correction and strengthening. Trump claims to be a Christian.
Enjoy.
President Trump: He's a liar and a cheat. He's an adulterer that betrayed who is supposed to be his greatest friend. He's a Christian that says he's never sinned whis puts him on level with my lord The Christ. He punished the country with a poisonous vaccine that doesn't vaccinate and is responsible for untold injury against my fellow citizens, some I know. Permanent life changing injury and death. He's the definition of superficial. You can find in the old testament God uses leaders like him (mature men that act like children) to punish nations.
He used my lord to make a few bucks and it makes me want to puke. If he is willing to betray his most loyal companion, he'll not think twice about betraying me or you.How's that?
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
I'm thinking, NOT.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Well ... even the school said he was wrong: Statement in Response to the 2024 Benedictine College Commencement Address
The sisters of Mount St. Scholastica do not believe that Harrison Butker's comments in his 2024 Benedictine College commencement address represent the Catholic, Benedictine, liberal arts college that our founders envisioned and in which we have been so invested. Instead of promoting unity in our church, our nation, and the world, his comments seem to have fostered division. One of our concerns was the assertion that being a homemaker is the highest calling for a woman. We sisters have dedicated our lives to God and God's people, including the many women whom we have taught and influenced during the past 160 years. These women have made a tremendous difference in the world in their roles as wives and mothers and through their God-given gifts in leadership, scholarship, and their careers. Our community has taught young women and men not just how to be "homemakers" in a limited sense, but rather how to make a Gospel-centered, compassionate home within themselves where they can welcome others as Christ, empowering them to be the best versions of themselves. We reject a narrow definition of what it means to be Catholic. We are faithful members of the Catholic Church who embrace and promote the values of the Gospel, St. Benedict, and Vatican Il and the teachings of Pope Francis.
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Russel A. Kester
The Sisters had their say. Why weren't the brothers interviewed as the college was created when the men's and women's colleges combined to form the current college. The Kansas City Star, from which this post came, should have asked them too as well as the local bishop who is the authority in that diocese. A slanted article.
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James Riggle-Johnson
Yes, Servant, he did speak his views to a Catholic school and there is nothing wrong with that. There is also nothing wrong with people criticizing him on his views regarding women and their place in society. As for the antichrist, I think the Orange Jesus, who calls himself the chosen one fits that bill to a T.
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ServantOfJudgement
James,
Considering the man said he's never sinned, he's either fully ignorant of Christianity or he thinks he's on par with Jesus. Either one should raise a christians eyebrows. I dont have a problem with an atheist saying he hasn't sinned. They're not held to a biblical standard, only their own. That's fine, we've got that right regardless of government or politics.
A Christian knows better than to say that. It's in direct violation of the core Christian philosophy that says we've all got some hangups no matter who you are or where you came from.
Antichrists can be in any form that opposes The Christ. Could be something I say, could be something you say. THE Antichrist is the embodiment of the total opposition and replacement to THE Christ, our Lord, Jesus The Christ.
Trump ain't clever or charismatic enough to fool the world. He's a child wearing man pants and a fat wallet. Look elsewhere.
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Thomas P. Davis
The term anti-Christ can be used two ways. I. against or 2. in place of. Most believers pick choice number one, against. While others pick choice number two in place of. In place of is the better choice. Everyone will be looking for this dastardly figure to show up instead of looking for a Judas. A man that looked like a believer and church goer and loved the Lord and also called the son of perdition. The antichrist is also described as the son of perdition. Paul says he will sit in his church and proclaim that he is God and John says that he will say that Jesus did not come in the flesh. So, my question is who in this world fits all those descriptors.
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Russel A. Kester
Nicely said SOJ.
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Joe Stutler
That derp's a misogynist homophobic bigot, plain and simple. That he blames his imaginary deity for his profound bigotry is a clear sign that we need far better mental health care in our nation.
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Michael Rose
And, in the future, if not now, too many hits to the head. IF ALS were to ever arise in his career, or his body gives out due to the rigors of this "sport", his family is screwed.
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Rev. Michael Gerraghty II
Best thing I have read in a LONG time!
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Diane Silverberg
Amen to that. The Devil is having fun creating hatred and destroying human kindness.
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Patti Anne Lisenbee
"The Devil is having fun creating hatred..." No. This is solely human doing. If you read the bible through, the Devil barely does anything, god does all the hatred and destroying human kindness. Try reading it and see!
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Bond Wright
We need another revolution....not "mental health care".
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Robert James Ruhnke
Hey Bond, we need both. Good gods, if you treat the mental health of everyone, things like hoarding of wealth, and price gouging for the sake of greed would be better handled and more people would be better off. A Revolution in how we treat our mental health recipients, and over all healthcare would take care of more of problems than a violent Revolution would.
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Robert Edgar Lamoureux
Do you truly believe either of those? I am not sure in which scenario the most harm would done. A revolution by most definitions, is violent. When people do not get the mental health care the need at best the suffer unnecessarily, at worse harm themselves or others. Please reconsider your statements.
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David Arthur Lewis
This guy is just one playing card in the world's biggest casino. Moral clarity does not exist in the sports world.
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William Leon Barfield jr
He should worry more about the season than what others do.
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Alexander Arends
Good for Harrison Butker. He was speaking as a Catholic at a Catholic College. He expressed his belief, as controversial as it may be. Please don't begin muzzling anyone for speaking up for their faith. You don't have to agree with him. You have the same privilege.
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William Harrison Anderson
Telling women simply to be "homemakers" when his own mother is an oncological radiologist? Who would be the president if Joe Biden died? This guy has issues.
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ServantOfJudgement
Plenty of women desire to be "home makers". Gosh, y'all praise a prostitute and condemn a woman who wants to raise kids. Don't like it? Then marry a whore so you can praise your wife.
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Patricia Ann Gross
I don't think anyone is condemning anyone who wants to raise kids. I applaud the women who would make that their life's ambition. My mother was one and she did it remarkably well, and was never paid a dime for it. Many women choose differently, or don't have a choice since today's economy is such that it requires two incomes. My mother was widowed in 1959 with three kids and could not make enough money to pay a babysitter for them. She lived on Social Security Survivor's benefits until she remarried and funneled the benefits for us to a college fund that paid for all of our bachelor's degrees. There are single mothers out there by choice or chance. Women need to be able to raise children and that sometimes requires that they go out in the workforce to make the money to support them.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Doesn't he work on the sabbath? That's a sin isn't it? Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.
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ServantOfJudgement
This is why God recommends marrying a fellow Christian. They're going to have the same core beliefs and are more likely to get along, stay together and raise children in unison. Makes for a good home when a man and woman truck through life as a team. If women or men don't see the value in that then stay away from a Christian, no big deal.
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Danny D. Maynard
Gid did not recommend anything! Humans made those societal requirements up!
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, from a materialist's perspective your statement might seem true. But from a spiritual perspective it is false. God does speak to humanity all the time in many ways. As scripture says, let he who has ears hear.
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Danny D. Maynard
"God speaking" is an interpretation without any corroborating evidence of a supernatural deity! That only happen within one's demented mind! And it only manifests in the behavior that one must display or filter from being displayed if it is harmful behavior. Gods are not needed for that. For that same idea, we could just as easily say: "The Devil made you do it!", too! Think on that for a change!
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, while I can agree that personal revelation isn't to become church doctrine without a lot or corroborating evidence, that is not to say it doesn't happen. Calling it demented just because you haven't had such an experience is shortsighted. I haven't experienced the weightlessness of space, but I don't declare that it therefore doesn't exist. If one doesn't believe in God, then one wouldn't understand the meaning of God's word as a living reality. But if one does, as have untold numbers of people down through history, then one doesn't doubt God or the living Word. It's a matter of faith..
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Danny D. Maynard
I have a good understanding of English, and I can translate several other languages, including Greek and Egyptian Hieroglyphics. That is more than enough to read any scripture and understand its meaning. It is too bad you do not read what you see and understand what is written.
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, I did not refer to only a written page when I referred to the LIVING word. It is an error to think that being able to read the literal words on a page is all that is needed to understand Scripture. There is so much more to it. As I said, faith allows one to understand the living Word. Those without faith do not understand.
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Michael Hunt
God spoke to me yesterday and told me that you're a liar so therefore it must be truth?
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Russel A. Kester
Michael, I highly doubt the veracity of your statement. In any case, that would be considered a private revelation and hence should be kept private.
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Robert James Ruhnke
I live 20 minutes from Benedictine College in Atchison Kansas. It’s a small town with many of the small town horror stories that plague women and LGBTQ+ people. It is a strict Catholic college. It’s also run by a person who considered cheap undocumented labor a perfectly fine avenue, whilst also decrying “illegals” and a border problem. Lots of hypocrisy goes on at that school. “Shut up, and kick the ball.” Is my attitude towards this guy. He’s got a gross vibe about him where he’d gladly dump his of 20 years during a mid life crisis for a younger woman. If she doesn’t dump him first when she realizes what a creep he is.
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Bridget Kielas-Fecyk
There is no hate like "Religious Love" it seems. This is very heartbreaking. In fact, in all bibles that reference Jesus in a new testament, he teaches to love everyone unconditionally, to care for others and not judge them. To open one's arms to all no matter what.
And they completely IGNORE these teachings, but instead that "god hates" and go on and on about how they're acting "like jesus would". And no, absolutely not. He would not act like that at all.
In fact, if the man they call Jesus was born today, speaking the way he spoke, and helping others the way he did, they would call him a terrorist and a "leftist". They would spew tons of hate against him and say how he should die or be imprisoned. And call him filth.
Because they no longer follow the ACTUAL teachings they claim they follow. They follow a rhetoric of hate and rage.
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Danny D. Maynard
You are a blessed Angel on Earth, Bridget! Thank you! <3
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ServantOfJudgement
Jesus would be crucified today. Once he started telling people like you and I to stop the things we think aren't sins, we'd crucify him.
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Robert James Ruhnke
Yeah by conservative Christians because he’s not a pro war, pro hate, pro bigotry type of guy. Y’all would label him the Antichrist and go after him. You’re speaking solely for yourself, SOJ.
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LJ Schalm
Could not have said it any better Bridget.
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Andrew Keith Dupree
I agree with Bridget Kielas-Fecyk, wonderfully said as I would have. Many today have mis-construed the Written Words thus have now accepted the leniency equivalent to the times of Soddom and Gomorrah which where we are in now.
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Merlin
Free speech can have a cost.
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Najah P Tamargo
Najah Tamargo - USA
Well then - I suppose he doesn't like The Pope of his own faith either??? Too open-minded and too much a modern thinker??? He needs to shut up and keep his archaic thoughts to himself!!! I was a homemaker....and a working mother. Sir: SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE!!!
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Russel A. Kester
Naja, he was invited to speak by a Catholic College to a Catholic audience and espoused traditional Catholic sentiments. I don't think the Pope would take issue with anything he said. And his address seems to have been well received. Why would any of that trigger you to the point you feel justified in demanding his silence? We believe in freedom of speech, remember?
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Robert James Ruhnke
That man is using his freedom of speech to silence and talk down to women. Us speaking out and against what he’s saying isn’t silencing him. Telling him to shut up his hypocrisy doesn’t mean he necessarily has to.
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Patti Anne Lisenbee
Freedom of speech also means you pay the consequences for what you said. Harrison Butker deserves every bit of repercussion he gets. the man shows hate personified through and through.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, I didn't hear anything in his speech that told the women in the audience to shut up nor did he seem to talk down to them. He also reminded men of their duties and responsibilities. I don't see where he was a hypocrite. He seems to live by what he said in his address. Therefore, any efforts to silence him are improper. And letting what he says trigger someone isn't healthy.
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Robert James Ruhnke
Because you were too busy checking HIM out, and not paying attention to what was said.
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Russel A. Kester
Hahahahaha. Well, could be. I wouldn't be the first person to have their head turned by a handsome face.
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Danny D. Maynard
Either you heard him wrong or you read the transcript with some erroneous understanding.
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Russel A. Kester
No, I heard correctly.
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Patricia Ann Gross
Think of the audience. This was an audience of women who had just spent at least four years of their life and in excess of $100K for a degree he called worthless, because the best thing they could aspire to is "homemaker." Why not celebrate their great accomplishment? Why not acknowledge their stamina? Where were the encouragements for how they could change the world? I just graduated with my doctorate, and the Commencement speaker had all of this.
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Russel A. Kester
Patricia, he didn't say their degrees were worthless. He did say that many, not all, women in the audience would go on to become mothers and wives which is a higher vocational calling and more rewarding than anything else they might do in their lives. That accords with Catholic doctrine and is true as so many parents have said. No one will do anything more important in their life than having a child and being outstanding an parent. None. He was right to remind the audience that life is not all about them. Its about family and society. Their degrees were but preparation for the true challenges and rewards of their lives.
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Robert Edgar Lamoureux
I am so glad the doctor who found my cancer and saved my life did not limit herself to scrubbing a kitchen. Because I would be dead and never would meet my awesome wife, who raised a child on her own, yet was educated and spent her life keeping people safe and healthy.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, yes our society is blessed to have doctors who find diseases and recommend good cures. If your doctor had decided to be a housewife then another good doctor would have diagnosed your condition. It wasn't your doctor's sex that enabled your cure, it is the current state of our medical care.
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Susan Christine Giganti
He was talking about Catholic values that puts two opposite gendered parents as the ideal for raising a family. He was at Catholic college, as an alumni.
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John Ash McCormick
What level of sin did the gladiators have? How about making a lot of money contributing to severe brain damage among the players who get the hits? Is that a sin? Or just business?
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Colleen McAllister
This man has had too many butts to the head. What else would explain his odd world view. He needs help
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ServantOfJudgement
It's a biblical view, surely a strange view nowadays as you've said but still a biblical view.
He might be one of those Christians that actually believe the Bible.
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
so someone that believe in fairy tales you consider important? sad, so very, very sad hail satan
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Please show me where in the bible, Jesus says any of the hateful things that Harrison Butker is spouting.
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ServantOfJudgement
I guess it's that secret language the Bible says you'll only understand if you believe it. Funky stuff.
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Danny D. Maynard
And, SOJ, it is too funky for sane humans who are logical and have a decent understanding of the real world.
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Russel A. Kester
Butker is a voice for those who have felt their voices silenced by the world of woke. What he said seems to agree with traditional Catholic values. And he is right that following those values beings happiness to home and country. He is probably not going to be the last person to do so. If this is the beginning of evidence that the pendulum is swinging in the other direction the results might well dismay the far-left fanatics of today. I've written before that the trans activists would wreak havoc on gays and lesbians if they didn't disassociate themselves in the minds of the larger public as being birds of a different feather. I still hope they will as our concerns are not the same. If his comments lead to the death of DEI and similar bad ideologies all the better. Alas, his comments of the likelihood that women can actually feel more fulfilled as mothers and housewives has truth to it and there is no greater calling on earth. Women were traditionally the glue that held society together. Which might explain why we're falling apart today. If the above is correct, and there is growing evidence that the backlash is, I do fear for gays and lesbians as they, due to their own alliances with the wrong groups, will be swept up in the coming storm. So much gained will be lost. One need only review the freedoms in Germany before the rise of the Nazis to see how quickly civil liberties given by the state can be retracted and replaced with civil punishments. Let's pray I'm wrong.
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Tecla Caryl Loup
As a recovering Catholic, I say BS.
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Russel A. Kester
Tecla, the fact that you describe yourself as a recovering Catholic seems to indicate that your opinions are far from disinterested or neutral. He has a right to his beliefs and to encourage others, especially fellow Catholic, to keep their faith as given to them in their scriptures and traditions. Clearly, that wasn't for you, and you chose a different path which is your right and a courageous thing to do. But you can still be happy for him and those who believe as he does that they have, evidently, found theirs.
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Tecla Caryl Loup
Part A: So who says I have to be neutral? You have no idea of what happened to me as a young Roman Catholic.
Part B: Butker could have refrained from promoting a particular lifestyle for all women. He can have the wife & daughters that he desires but it really isn't his place to promote this as the ultimate achievement for all females, any more than promoting the idea that mens' ultimate achievement is impregnating their female of choice. Look at his mom, e.g.
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Russel A. Kester
Tecla, stating that your assessment wasn't neutral highlights that you have an axe to grind. It's difficult to give someone a fair hearing under such a condition.
Butker did not promote a particular lifestyle for all women. He clearly said that some would go into the work world or academia. He then went on to say that he thought most of the female members of his audience would be looking forward to motherhood which given his audience was probably true. And he continues to praise them who are called to the vocation of being a wife and mother saying it was their highest calling. Later he said much the same to men. Being a mother or father is the most challenging and rewarding vocation one can follow. I've heard creators of large business empires say that these were nothing compared to being a parent. Any not called to the vocation of parenthood should not disparage those who are so called.
That is why having an axe to grind can prevent one from hearing what is actually being said. One's filters color the actual message.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
Russel, always so many words to end up saying so little of value. Mostly sounds like whining because you don't feel like you get to be exclusive (un-Christ like) rather than inclusive (Christ like). I don't even need to address your hypocrisy, simply addressing your continued confirmation bias should be enough as you don't appear to be interested in being correct or supporting a justifiable position, just pacifying your need to 'feel' a certain way about an issue seems to be enough for you. It's a sad state that a noisy minority who parrot 'opinions' similar to yours work so hard to divide people over nonsense rather than working together to celebrate the diversity of our vastly colorful world.
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James Riggle-Johnson
Well said, Rev Klaire.
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Danny D. Maynard
You get my vote, Rev.. Klaire! Preach it! Russel cannot see his own hypocrisy! He also produces many servings of world salad too!
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Russel A. Kester
Klaire, you wrote that I wasn't interested in being correct. Correct in whose opinion? Whose morals or standards are to be used? I supported the man's right to his beliefs which were shared by his audience. Didn't we all sign our agreement to the proposition that everyone has a right to their beliefs when we signed up to be ULC ministers? I also questioned if this is perhaps a sign the political pendulum is swinging back in the other direction. We don't celebrate our diversity by denigrating a sincere Catholic in his beliefs.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
Russel, that's what you lead with from my comment??? That's what you thought was the important part? That's truly sad! Your comments continue to be a representation of a guy that's trying to pound his own testicles flat with a 2oz. jeweler's hammer!
The fact that nearly every one of your comments is layered with non-Christ like over and under tones doesn't make you cringe at how easy it is for readers to identify your hypocrisy?!?
To address your specific nonsensical question "that I wasn't interested in being correct. Correct in whose opinion?", answers my subject about your issues with confirmation bias. If I weren't correct in that, you would have been able to understand that 'correctness' is a product of empirical analysis. We can, with ease and certainty, determine that you are wrong in nearly everything you've written here as it not only doesn't rise to the level of empirically true statements, a rigid analysis of the things you attempt to support are actually countered by better, scientifically reasoned data.
Now, to address the oversimplification of your thesis that there is a "proposition that everyone has a right to their beliefs", you mistakenly conflate the idea that your own beliefs must remain unchecked because they are your own beliefs (a very circular and wrong attempt at supporting your position). You can "believe" whatever you like but that is not equivalent to being correct. Certainly, if the un-Christ like things you attempt to support have the potential to harm others, there WILL be people available to remind you of how wrong you are.
And finally, NO, the "political pendulum" is not swinging in another direction. The data, as well as the history of myth, mysticism, and religion is quite clear. Throughout the last 50-65 thousand years of human behavioral modernity, myth, mysticism and religion continue to be replaced, at an ever increasing pace, with processes and ideas of reason associated with critical thinking.
In conclusion, yes, we celebrate our diversity by pointing out (and denigrating) the things that attempt to divide and exclude groups for the illegitimate goal of protecting their own inclusivity. The data is also clear that your 'opinions' are that of a noisy minority who so badly wants to remain relevant but never learned the social and intellectual skills required to meet the needs of the time in which you live.
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Russel A. Kester
Klaire, you, like others, engaged in colorful ad hominem attacks instead of forming a reasoned argument. You also failed to provide any examples of things for which you wrongly castigate me. You made it clear that you believe religion, including Christianity, should "be replaced, at an ever increasing pace, with processes and ideas of reason associated with critical thinking." So any references you make to one being Christ like or not would be outside the scope of your mindset and worldview; a fish out of water. And why would you think that one can celebrate diversity by denigrating people who think differently than the in-group with which one associates? No, I think such personal attacks and attempts to denigrate others are most likely done from places of weakness and fear. Mischaracterizing another's statements or positions are acts of desperation. Perhaps people like Butker stepping up and speaking out is threatening to far-left ideologues. Perhaps when fellow ministers here question or challenge the ambitions and goals of bad ideologies it creates such cognitive dissonance in some that all they can do is lash out. Perhaps students weren't allowed to call BS on the bad teaching in college, but this is life. And I'm calling BS on the ideologies of DEI and transgender activists. If the tide were not turning as I suspect it is so many would not be so triggered.
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Danny D. Maynard
Exactly and precisely define the word: "woke" do for us, without you using Google or any other search engine, and do it in your own words, please! Trans people are not wrecking havoc. It is the religious fanatics like you that do that. Quit spreading your prejudicial hate, and all of that will go away. I did not see society falling apart. But, y'all do love to "burn down the village to save it!" Bless your pea pickin little dark heart, as you have displayed in your comment! In 2024, MAGA white Christian Nationalist Republicanism is directly akin to Fascism from the 1930s and 1940s. I learned well from those who fought for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in World War II, and you are not of their kind!
I believe in the "It takes a village to raise a child, or an help an adult!" philosophy, you tear down what has been built rather that working to make it better. How dare you be so dark!
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, Webster's dictionary defines woke, as I use it, as, "politically liberal or progressive (as in matters of racial and social justice) especially in a way that is considered unreasonable or extreme." I get to use any source I wish to define my terms and no one has the right to dictate otherwise. Trans Activists like all social justice activists purposefully engage to disrupt and destroy the normative values of society in order to impose their own. That is the very definition of wreaking havoc. Those who you label as religious fanatics, who is anyone who disagrees with you and your ilk, you claim are spreading hate when in fact they are advocating for the preservation of their values which is their right.
What a sense of entitlement it takes to believe one has a right to silence another person because they don't like what is said; such hubris. The rest of your comment went into things I didn't, so they should be accepted as your opinions without foundation in fact.
Your last sentence was really something. You point an accusative finger, figuratively speaking, and write, "How dare you be so dark!" What was that all about? It sounded like Sherlock Holmes declaring that his arch enemy, Professor James Moriarty, was the culprit. Very dramatic.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
Wrong, that is NOT what Webster's dictionary defines woke as. Much like you do with your bible, you've decided to "cherry-pick" the explainer section referencing modern usage instead of giving the actual definition. (Or, maybe you don't know the difference or purpose between these sections of the dictionary) in either case, your answer is wrong and likely leads us to understand why you end up being wrong on so many other issues!
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Russel A. Kester
- disapproving : politically liberal or progressive (as in matters of racial and social justice) especially in a way that is considered unreasonable or extreme.Apr 18, 2024 https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/woke
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Danny D. Maynard
Then you are quite unwoke! How sad!
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Russel A. Kester
With God's help, I awaken to deeper spiritual truths everyday.
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Danny D. Maynard
Your quote: "What a sense of entitlement it takes to believe one has a right to silence another person because they don't like what is said; such hubris." My response is "Physician, heal thyself! Your hypocrisy is astronomically huge!"
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, if I've told anyone in my comments to shut up, then I was wrong to do so. But I don't recall having ever done such a thing. If you know of one, please telle so that I can apologize.
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Danny D. Maynard
You definitely would censor those you do not like (and will never meet!) were you given half a chance. We understand your kind quite well!
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, so you admit that I haven't tried to censor anyone here by telling them to shut up. But then you say that I would if I could because you understand my kind quite well. Since I'm a free speech advocate and have written here in past comments that even hate speech should be countered with better speech, it does not seem that you know me or my kind at all. What you're experiencing is called projection, I think.
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Robert James Ruhnke
Kester you try to gaslight people into silence. lol. You don’t need to say shut up when you have just as demeaning vocabulary. You try to get people to question their realities, try to project emotionality onto arguments, but when called out on your own misbehavior you completely ignore what’s being said.
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Russel A. Kester
Robert, isn't questioning ones reality and as well as others what one does when searching for the truth? But I don't think I'm guilty of projecting emotions onto arguments. But I do acknowledge them if I see them. Strong emotions can cloud ones thinking. Anyone can get emotional, but it's usually a mistake in dialog when two people have opposing ideas. But no one is perfect.
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Danny D. Maynard
You think you write better speech, but you do not! Your bad ideas are covered up with flowery language that has no meaning to anyone who is logical and sane.
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, them by all means show examples from my comments and disclose the logical errors or fallacies contained within them. Doing so would be a great service to me and everyone here as we do wish to reveal bad arguments and poor reasoning.
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Joe Stutler
He's an anthropomorphic personification of a burn pit, as are his supporters. ;-)
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William Harrison Anderson
I think if Harrison Butker's ideas were carried out, our world would be a gross amalgamation of The Stepford Wives and A Handmaid's Tale, with The Cider House Rules thrown in. Nobody told his mother that she couldn't be a scientist, or if so, she didn't listen. So why should we listen to him? As far as Catholic values, and I speak as a Roman Catholic, did St. Teresa of Avila settle for the title of "homemaker?" Well, according to Rome, she has two titles, Saint and Doctor of the Church. As do St. Thérèse Lisieux and St. Catherine of Sienna. I wonder if Harrison Butker knows that?
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Susan Christine Giganti
The Catholic Church considers consecrated single life, married life, and religious life or priesthood as vocations. The current Catholic Catechism requires both parents to care for children. There is nothing in the wording forbidding married women from working outside the home. Butker was praising his stay-at-home wife. They can afford it.
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James Riggle-Johnson
Russel, voices being ignored is not the same as voices being silenced. The world of woke you describe is simply the voices of marginalized groups speaking out. There is nothing wrong with diversity. The pendulum always swings back and forth, but this time it may not swing as far as you would expect. Today a majority of people are seeing that the LGBTQ community are not the monsters they were led to believe.
As for trans activists, it is the far-right that keep screaming about trans people and trying to erase them from existence. They don’t realize they have always been there, and they always will be. You are talking about less than 1% of the LGBTQ community. The question is why does this small portion of people threaten the far right? They are only being used as a political weapon for reelection campaigns. Don’t buy into the far-right militants who use diversity to divide us.
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Russel A. Kester
James, you have some good thoughts in your comments some of which I agree. I don't object to voices being ignored, per se, though I think even an idiot can have something to say worth hearing. It is those who tell others to shut up, go away, stop commenting, and similar expressions who are trying to silence others. Sadly, there are some like that here.
I don't think the world of woke is just the voices of marginalized people. To me it's groups of activists and professors who believe they have a mandate to change society in a way they believe is better and give no ear to what others believe or think.
I agree that no LGB or T or Q person is a monster. Everyone deserves to be treated with tolerance and kindness and dignity. Even, dare I say, love if the other person is capable. No monsters. But there are some bad actors.
I don't know who you're including in the term far-right. If your mean neo Nazis, then perhaps I can agree with your statement about trans persons, but I'm not seeing them engage in general conversation. If you mean people to the right of an activist's position than I disagree. It is not the existences of trans persons that is being challenged and rejected, but it is the theories and practices of the activists whether trans or allies.
You're right that trans persons are less than 1% of the population and no one would really notice if activists had stayed away from children and didn't have the backing of big money and big pharma to push values onto society which most of society rejects. But it is the nature of activism to force such issues which creates conflict. Once started, like a fire, it's hard to put out.
Finally, it is the activists, including activist teachers and professors, who are dividing our country and the whole of Western Civilization in the name of diversity and inclusivity which are misused terms as the true goal is domination and exclusion of any who disagree with the far-left, woke agenda.
Nice discussion. Thank you.
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James Riggle-Johnson
Kester, thank you for your reply. I’m curious. Do you actually know any parents of trans children? Do you know how I trans minor goes about their discovery? I’m not talking about propaganda, but what actually happens? It’s less devious, sinister, or harmful than you think. Also, people are not recruiting youth to be trans. You probably wouldn’t even know about them if it weren’t for the ones insisting it’s wrong.
I won’t pretend to know what is going on in a trans person’s mind to make them feel they were born into the wrong body. It isn’t happening to me. I know I’m a man through and through. What I do know is what it means to feel you are different. I knew from a young age that I was different… long before I knew anything about sexuality. When I began noticing I was attracted to men I was horrified. Based on my upbringing I thought I was evil. I prayed over and over again for God to take away these feelings. I was ashamed.
It led to me having to run away from home at the age of 16 and never return. I can’t tell you the horrors a 16 year old child goes through without the support of family, but somehow, I managed to survive no thanks to the people who should have loved me no matter what.
Had I been born in the last 20 years I probably wouldn’t have suffered all the self-loathing and fear I went through as a child. I wasn’t trained or indoctrinated to be gay. I was born that way. That’s why I don’t judge trans people. I may not understand it but I don’t have to. I believe like me, they just know.
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Russel A. Kester
James, sharing your experience as a gay youth brought tears to my eyes. While our experiences are not dissimilar, yours was by far much more difficult and heartbreaking. Yes, we did know from an earlier age that we felt differently than many of our peers or others around us. What we were experiencing is a natural variation in sexuality for a fairly steady percentage of the population. But are our experiences similar or dissimilar to one experiencing trans identity issues? I submit they are dissimilar. Which is why I have held to allowing anyone experiencing such mental health concerns to follow the guidelines in the DMS-5-TR and those in the Cass Report. These are the professionals in these matters, not teachers, sociology professors, or activists funded by big money. The best you or I can do in trying to sympathize with these persons is to read papers and articles from the professionals on dissociative disorders like this quote from the Mayo Clinic, "Symptoms depend in part on the type of dissociative disorder and can range from memory loss to disconnected identities." (https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/dissociative-disorders/symptoms-causes/syc-20355215#:~:text=Dissociative%20disorders%20are%20mental%20health,%2C%20surroundings%2C%20behavior%20and%20identity.)
We can, however, refute claims made on the basis of biology which are unproven. And we can resist having an entire population subjected to sociological theories that say that gender doesn't exist because it's only performative acts allowing one to feel male today and female tomorrow or to be straight one day but gay the next. Those are lies being propagated in the name of Trans issues. We're gay. It's inherent and unchanging. We didn't bow to Anita Bryant and the religious right in the 70s and 80s when they told us we'd made a choice, and I won't bow today to sociological theories that tell me it's a choice based on my actions.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Russel A. Kester Jesus was the most "woke" person" in history.
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Russel A. Kester
Matthew, unlikely since he was a practicing Jew and forbade divorce even when the laws of Moses allowed it. He had no delusions as to people's sins, but advocated that they repent and sin no more. So he clearly believed in normative judgements.
However, make your case. It would be good to understand how you came to your conclusion.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
The term "woke" generally refers to being aware of social injustices, particularly those related to race, gender, and other forms of discrimination, and being actively engaged in addressing and combating them. You wanted examples of Jesus's teachings and actions being "woke"? Here ya go:
1: Championing the marginalized: Jesus consistently reached out to and advocated for those who were marginalized in society, such as the poor, the sick, women, and ethnic minorities. He challenged the social norms of his time by associating with and showing compassion for those who were often overlooked or mistreated.
2: Social justice: Jesus preached about love, compassion, and justice for all. He spoke out against oppression and exploitation, emphasizing the importance of treating others with fairness and dignity. His teachings on caring for the needy, feeding the hungry, and clothing the naked reflect a commitment to social justice and equality.
3: Inclusivity: Jesus welcomed everyone into his circle, regardless of their social status, ethnicity, or background. He dined with tax collectors and sinners, healed the sick, and embraced those who were considered outcasts by society. His message of love and acceptance extends to all people, promoting inclusivity and breaking down barriers of prejudice and discrimination.
4: Challenging power structures: Jesus challenged the religious and political authorities of his time, critiquing their hypocrisy and corruption. He spoke truth to power, advocating for a more just and equitable society. His actions, such as overturning the tables of the money changers in the temple, demonstrated a willingness to confront unjust systems and practices.
5: Nonviolent resistance: While Jesus advocated for social change, he did so through nonviolent means. He taught his followers to turn the other cheek, to love their enemies, and to resist evil with good. His example of enduring suffering and persecution without resorting to violence is a powerful testament to the principles of nonviolent resistance and activism.
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Russel A. Kester
Matthew, all excellent points. Let me comment on each briefly, hopefully.
Wonderful summation and still the work of the church today. Though the term social justice you used is problematic as it is used differently in the church than by activists.
Wonderful summation. But I don't think his idea of social justice is the same as how that term is used today.
Again, wonderful. However, he preached the need to repent and sin no more. So he reached out in order to bring them into his kingdom but to be his disciples meant a transformation in how they lived.
He defended his mission when the religious authorities challenged him. He didn't seek them out. He overturned the tables saying the temple was to be a house of prayer which is not the same as confronting unjust systems and practices. It was done in the name of his religious piety not a social justice issue.
Yes, he did preach nonviolence and to love even ones enemies, but he did not preach activism as understood and practiced today. He and his disciples didn't shout down the Sanhedrin or riot in the streets of Jerusalem. In fact, his adversaries had to go out of their way to find him on the outskirts of towns and in desert places.
As for the term 'woke,' even the Buddha told people to wake up from their sleep of illusions and once awakened they were then enlightened to reality which the Christ also preached using different imagery and words. Their ideas of being awakened (woke) was not the same as described by your definition above. And neither actively engaged in resisting the social issues you listed. They practiced the idea of not resisting evil and it will flee from you. They didn't resist hate, they practiced love. They preached God's justice not our sense of justice. In fact, the Christ said that if a Roman soldier forces one to carry a pack one mile, he should carry it two. Surely being so treated was a social injustice, but Christ did not say resist, fight back, and assault him.
So, no Jesus Christ was not a woke social justice warrior. He was the Son of God who came to redeem a fallen world by repentance of one's personal sins. He never preached that his followers should go out and riot in the streets, he preached that they should go out and preach the Gospel not social theories.
You put a lot of thought into your response. That was so much more than is often done here. I enjoyed our exchange. I listened to your words and pondered them carefully. Thank you for them.
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Thank you for the same.
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Danny D. Maynard
Jesus, a mythological character, did not forbid anything! Emperor Constantine did that in 325 CE, with other Romans Emperors to add more bricks of hate and prejudice to the pile, followed by a host of political popes over the next ~2,000 years!
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Russel A. Kester
Danny, first you said, "Jesus was the most 'woke' person" in history" and then you said, "Jesus, a mythological character, did not forbid anything." So which was he a woke person or a mythological character?
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Russel A. Kester
My bad. It was Matthew who said Jesus was woke and Danny who said he was a mythical figure.
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Danny D. Maynard
Jesus is both mythological and woke. Your imagination has made it so!
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Russel A. Kester
LOL. Thank you for the laugh. It's good to see a sense of humor.
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Danny D. Maynard
It is a shame that you do not take my truthful claims seriously!
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Michael Hunt
So you're saying that Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) are bad things in a society? If that's the case, I don't want to be anywhere near the society you create for yourself. That sounds like a miserable, hate-filled place.
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Russel A. Kester
Michael, the ideas we have of what the terms diversity, equity, and inclusion mean are all good. But those words are just a marketing strategy for social justice warriors (sjw) whose true goals are domination and exclusivity. These activists want to distract, destabilize, and infiltrate in order to destroy the current society and social order in favor of their ideas for society. Once in power they do not share it and are brutal to anyone who questions their capital-T Truths based on far-left ideologies taught by bad sociological theories. What I do favor are equality of opportunity, the American melting pot, and liberty.
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Nicholas J Page
If I was Butker I would keep my mouth shut about the LGBTQ and concentrate on his. NFL and not to involve him self he knows nothing about I'm a hetrosexial man and treat everyone the way I want to be treated.We have 2 gay ladies living above us and the loveliest people you can meet.I don't criticise their way of living
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Katelynne Shouse
More "Christian love"! 😪
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Echo
I could do without this love being spewed out of thier mouth. Hopefully one day they will see this as the hate that it is.
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Daniel Gray
Hopefully you will one day see that this is their 1st Amendment right to say this and if you dont like it them move on. Whining here isnt doing you any good at all.
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Joe Stutler
Sure, bigots have the Right to Freedom of Speech. As a decorated disabled combat Veteran I paid the price for that bigot's Right to spew his hateful message. As an American with the same Rights I can state that the misogynist homophobic bigot can bugger off, as can his pathetic defenders. :-)
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Daniel Gray
Sorry Joe, thats just YOUR OPINION and not based on fact or reality or law.
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Michael Hunt
No, he really can tell the guy to bugger off because of freedom of speech. It's comical that when you do it, it's your First Amendment right but when someone you disagree with does it, then it's just their opinion and not fact based.
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ServantOfJudgement
Thanks for your service Joe.
As a disabled vet I'm surprised you aren't concerned about euthanasia programs societies like ours gravitate towards.Canada is rapidly approaching 1940 Germany and USA is rapidly approaching Canada. As we know, disabled folks got euthanized.
Fear not, this vet along with people like Butker would protect your right to life.
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Joe Stutler
Seriously, that's the best you could do? The USA isn't heading towards fascism aside from the Trumpublicans and his theofascist supporters. Try harder.
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ServantOfJudgement
Not really trying much joe beyond opening your eyes.
If you look up the definition of fascism you'll find each president has taken their own measures to bring us closer to that reality. King George Bush 1st, Clinton, King George Bush 2nd, Obama, Trump and Biden have all been combining government with corporations. It's too early to tell what type dictatorship we'll end up with. It really won't matter when it comes I guess.
I wish you could see that your president is a dirty dog but that's not likely. Your team seems skilled at ignoring his nasty nature. I hate to think of how far he went with his daughter in the shower she said they took together in her diary. Perhaps one day you'll see.
Take care Joe.
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Michael Hunt
Telling someone to open their eyes while running through life with yours closed is pure hypocrisy.
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Elizabeth Jane Erbe Wilcox
Kindly show us a true, irrefutable example of “ euthanasia programs ” in our country.
Ohhhhh, you mean Death With Dignity! Where a living person gets to determine when their life will end instead of enduring immeasurable pain and suffering while urinating, defecating, and vomiting on themselves. Gotta love your “christian” compassion.
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Daniel Gray
Amusing...according to MILPERCEN (Military Personnel Records Center) in St Louis, they have absolutely no record of you appearing anywhere in their records. And they have ALL the records of the military members past and present. Son one has to wonder why you are violating the Stolen Valor federal law of claiming something that the military says you never were part of.
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Joe Stutler
1) No, they don't have all records there. Surely you heard about the fire decades ago. 2) That they would release my records to some rando Internet schmuck isn't surprising. I'd happily compare DD 214s (and 215, and NGB 22) with you. No doubt you don't have any of those. Decorated disabled combat Veteran here, silly kitten. Your jealousy is, of course, completely understandable. Now run along and let the adults converse in peace. 😁
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Daniel Gray
Never asked for your military records Joe, DID ask if they had anyone with your name listed and they clearly stated no they did not. Nice try but major fail.
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Michael Hunt
I just contacted MILPERCEN too, Daniel, and they have no record of you appearing anywhere in their records either.
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Daniel Gray
Really? Hmmm, then I guess that means the VA and the US Department of the Army and my DD214 as well as the 101st Airborne are all liars now according to you? How pathetic do you have to be to think anyone is going to believe you Hunt? Especially when you have been proved wrong more times then Carter has liver spots.
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Rev. Klaire ThD, MA
Your "1st amendment right", like all of your rights comes with a huge amount of responsibility. The absolute irony and hypocrisy of your 4 line comment says way more (in a bad way) about you than any comment you inappropriately attempted to address.
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Gregory Ingram
Freedom of speech does not = freedom from consequences. Speak your truth and sleep in the bed you make.
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Daniel Gray
And if you do speak as to whats protected by the Constitution and it can be proved you are correct, then what do you have to worry about?
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Danny D. Maynard
The US Constitution stops the Government from imposing restrictions on Freedom of Speech and Press, and the right to Assemble. It does not stop other business entities, clubs, churches, political organizations and other groups from imposing their rules within their domain of activity, and for one to endure the consequences of breaking the rules within that particular domain only.
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Daniel Gray
Really Danny? Hows about you go into a movie theater and yell fire, or go into an airport and yell hijack or threaten to murder someone. All of that is well within your right to free speech but the ramifications of you doing it are far more then what you are willing to pay.
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Danny D. Maynard
l do not do such things. But criminals do those!
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Daniel Gray
then your post of the Government not being able to impose restrictions on freedom of speech is wrong then, correct?
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Danny D. Maynard
Well! Well! Well! We have a Butkeister among us ^^^^^!
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Daniel Gray
Nobody needs to know what you do in private thats TMI
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Danny D. Maynard
Your imagination runs wild, Daniel ,and now we know for sure what is on your mind!
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Joy
The first ammendment protects you from the government, not the rest of society. All of us can come here to say what we want, even if it is to point out that this football guy is a backward thinking person.
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ServantOfJudgement
A woman wanting to stay home and raise her IDs is hate? Who's she hating on, her kids or her husband?
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Danny D. Maynard
Probably both. Women went stark raving mad in the 1960s when they could not work outside the home and not have a bank account in their name.
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I wonder what his mother thinks.. She is a physicist and professionally successful. I guess he is betraying her,too.......
He betrayed no one. And he never said that women should not work. In fact, he acknowledged that some would go on to have wonderful careers. Then he acknowledged that most of the women were likely looking forward to being mothers. And that is likely true. His audience at one point gave him eight seconds of applause. He also said very similar things to the men in the audience. So, his mother is most likely very proud of her son.