A city in the Detroit area has just voted to allow residents to legally sacrifice large animals at home, so long as the killing is being performed for religious purposes.
Hamtramck, Michigan is home to a majority-Muslim community for whom ritual sacrifice is an important part of their faith. The Hamtramck City Council, whose members all identify as Muslim, approved the new policy in a 3-2 vote.
Many residents celebrated the decision, calling it a victory for religious freedom.
However, critics haven’t been shy in speaking out against the policy. Among them is PETA, which has decried animal sacrifice as a cruel and inhumane practice.
Animal Sacrifice in Islam
The ritual killing of animals is commonplace in many Muslim-majority countries around the world.
Followers of the Islamic tradition slaughter animals – typically goats or sheep – during the holiday of Eid al-Adha. The meat from the animal is then shared with family and friends, and even passed out to needy members of the community.
"It's not something new or novel," says Dawud Walid, director of the Michigan branch of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR).
Referencing the Quran, he continued: "This is when Muslims recognize Abraham sacrificing a sheep instead of having to sacrifice his son.”
The policy change in Hamtramck will allow Muslims to observe this sacred ritual.
"If somebody wants to do it, they have a right to do their practice," Council Member Mohammed Hassan explained.
There are also guardrails in place; residents will reportedly have to notify the city if they plan to perform a sacrifice, as well as pay a fee and make their property available for inspection.
PETA Fires Back
None of that has satisfied critics, who argue that animal sacrifice has no place in the modern world – religious ritual or not.
One of the loudest dissenters is PETA spokesperson Ashley Byrne, who voiced the group’s objections.
"We have to think about the fact that children are often exposed to these religious rituals," Byrne said. "These animals' throats are slashed and their heads are manually torn from their bodies."
She acknowledged that religious freedom is protected under the Constitution, but argued that “animal sacrifice should be a thing of the past because it's cruelty to animals, plain and simple."
Byrne also urged religious communities to seek ways to modify traditions to avoid hurting animals.
"We see ritual slaughter in many different places in the country, but we also see people working to find alternate traditions, like some Santería priests use red wine instead of animal blood now," she explained. "There are rabbis who encourage their orthodox followers to use money instead of chickens in Kaporos rituals."
Will Household Pets Be Affected?
Meanwhile, some people appear to be objecting out of fear that the policy would lead to their family pets being put in danger:
This seems to be a simple misreading of the law, which covers only those animals traditionally used in ritual sacrifice (like goats and sheep).
Nonetheless, that hasn’t prevented similar angry objections to Hamtramck’s new policy from across the internet.
What is your reaction? Should ritual sacrifice be allowed for religious purposes, or does this cross the line regarding inhumane treatment of animals?
103 comments
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Kevin Anthony Bishop
As I know it, the issue is the religious basis for ANY law. Congress (or any law-making body in the U.S.) is strictly forbidden by the First Amendment to make ANY laws that have a religious foundation. Every Constitutionally legitimate law is--must be-- based on a secular reason (i.e., SOCIAL CONTRACTS) to be Constitutionally VALID. This particular issue/law must NOT be based on religion, but rather on whether or not it transgresses Animal Cruelty Laws. Hunting/Killing animals for FOOD is NOT illegal, and this also includes other (unfortunate) reasons that have to do with industry. In fact, as mentioned in an earlier post, it is a regular and regulated occurrence every day in this country. Groups like PETA know this is a reality and do their very best to make sure (and rightfully so) that this process, when necessary, is as humane as possible. Pets are routinely euthanized as a matter of compassion for a beloved pet that is unnecessarily suffering or has proven itself to be irrevocably dangerous and/or harmful to people. Any other reasons are most likely already illegal under current anti-cruelty laws.
It has always been a sad misconception that this country was founded on religious principles. This is verifiably incorrect. The Constitution of The United States of America specifically and intentionally does NOT mention the word "god", and it strictly forbids any law-making body (Congress) from making any laws "respecting the establishment" of a religion--ANY religion. The Founders of this country understood that the only way a person could freely choose their own religion was to be free FROM religion, unlike other countries where freedom of religion is not a protected option. This, in effect, was the seperation of church and state mentioned in Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptist Church in 1802.
If a citizen of this country raises animals specifically for the purpose of food, it does not need to be considered a religious ritual to be legal. Many families have always, and continue to, raise animals for food. This council went too far in its reasoning and in its explanation for recognizing a right that already existed. The danger in this is the same danger that all religions can pose to America: Domestic Un- or Anti-American citizens who mistake the right to choose their own religion with a presumed right to IMPOSE their chosen religion on others, which is a huge mistake with disastrous consequences.
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Stephen Mohlaloga Makgoathane
If we still have Christian Jews and non-Christian Jews, meaning Jews that says We stay and rot in our Believe that THE OLD TESTAMENT IS HERE TO STAY and the New Testament CANNOT be used as the reference that Replaces SACRIFICES( SLAUGHTERING OF SHEEP GOATS COWS ETC) AND THE LAW OF MOSES. But'I'm serious to bring to your attention that JESUS CHRIST DYING FOR OUR SINS WAS THE LAST AND THE ONLY SACRIFICE OF THE SLAUGHTERING OF SHEEP etc " Bringing slaughtering of animals to end this practice.( JESUS CHRIST IS GOD" WHO WAS THERE ( PRESENT) AT THE BEGINNING ( Genesis) Thanks that's me.REV" STEPHEN TREVOR MOHLALOGA MAKGOATHANE.
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Lionheart
Oh, so was Jesus real then, Stephen? Did you read that somewhere?
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Stephen Mohlaloga Makgoathane
I pose RESPECT for all Religious beliefs. My Muslim brothers, you have my honor in your traditional ritual animal SACRIFICES.l hope you have your references such as your HOLY SCRIPTURES that serve as a guideline. REVEREND STEPHEN TREVOR MOHLALOGA MAKGOATHANE ( S.A)
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Juan Carlos Alatorre
God's ceation included animals on earth being given on to men under his protection. Therefore God's law of ,creation stands and defends respect for human life mother nature and that meant including animals to.. Animal slaughters and acts of violence commited by men with animals ought to be punished and abolished world wide. , Animal cruelty ,and paganist activies using animals,are just the begining for any twisted criminal 's minds outhere wating to prey on any humans later.. Them are considered as criminals psychopats and dangerous men living among barbarian socities of many thierd world countries. Here in America that is considered a crime by the laws of our USA Constitution. PETA We will always stand together in unity under these circumstances. While we pray for a much better world to be ,By rasing our voices for those inicents that got no voice. Working in unification on how to prevent criminal behavior and evil rituals from doing any more harm..God is warching and his almighty law will punish those evil men and he will deliver us from evil. God blesses those that do good deeds on to others. Amen. Pastor Juan,
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Paul Edward Nunis
Slaughtering halal and kosher meat in any location is for consumption, not sacrifice.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Then again, Paul. What if they shoot it with a Star Trek phaser, and it completely disappears?
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Nicholas J H Baldwin
We are ALL Gods creatures, Animals have every right to dwell on this earth without being butchered. I heartily oppose this dreadful practise. I am proud of my Chaplaincy and will do everything in my power to help our fellow Animals to survive. I live in the UK this would be outlawed over here.
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Deborah Jean Howard
No animals should be used for sacrifice. Be it religion being anything else. Wrong is wrong I meant which way you look at it.
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Stephen Mohlaloga Makgoathane
If we still have Christian Jews and non-Christian Jews, meaning Jews that says We stay and rot in our Believe that THE OLD TESTAMENT IS HERE TO STAY and the New Testament CANNOT be used as the reference that Replaces SACRIFICES( SLAUGHTERING OF SHEEP GOATS COWS ETC) AND THE LAW OF MOSES. But'I'm serious to bring to your attention that JESUS CHRIST DYING FOR OUR SINS WAS THE LAST AND THE ONLY SACRIFICE OF THE SLAUGHTERING OF SHEEP etc " Bringing slaughtering of animals to end this practice.( JESUS CHRIST IS GOD" WHO WAS THERE ( PRESENT) AT THE BEGINNING ( Genesis) Thanks that's me.REV" STEPHEN TREVOR MOHLALOGA MAKGOATHANE.
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Stephen Mohlaloga Makgoathane
Reverend Stephen Trevor Mohlaloga Makgoathane: I hope most of our commentators/ participants will agree with me when i say" THE INTENTION OF BRINGING THE NEW TESTAMENT PARTLY WAS TO REPLACE THE SACRIFICES OF SLAUGHTERING OF SHEEP,GOATS,COWS etc etc" with The Death of our LORD JESUS CHRIST. That's the point i want to bring to the attention of everyone" That Jesus Christ becomes the ONLY and the LAST Sacrifice in the Holy Scriptures. Thanks" REVEREND STEPHEN TREVOR MOHLALOGA MAKGOATHANE (SA)
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Gregory SG
Burnt offerings for the lord god, I personally do not believe we need do this. It was a test for a person in the bible and continued because it got attention like it is now. That being said do unto others is a good guide to follow. My concern is the sanitary conditions to do this act it's not in the desert sands anymore it will be in a house a yard a basement any other butcher must adhere to the laws on the books for health and safety of the people it is a lot of fluids to contain. maybe they could do it at there place of worship that would house all necessary items for the slaughter of animals. Your faith isn't dependent upon your acts it is dependent upon your belief.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
I bet God would like those offerings a lot better if they were well seasoned, instead of burnt.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
You can't give God something he doesn't already have. So, if you think you're giving God something you're only fooling yourself.
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Daniel Jude Atkinson
Barbaric…but it also happens every year when the Jewish community sacrifices thousands and thousands of chicken before Yom Kippur. 50,000 chickens in Brooklyn alone. I’d like to think we’ve advanced beyond animal sacrifice, but sadly we haven’t.
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Lionheart
Don’t mention SCOTUS to Daniel Gray. I did it once, but think I got away with it. 😱
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Daniel Gray
nobody understands what you are saying lion, but you.
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Lionheart
At least 2 did, Daniel, which is 2 more than “nobody”, so you’re wrong again.
Those that did, have obviously watched “Fawlty Towers” and understood the comment.
It’s obviously too deep for you.
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Robin Call
These animals are not sacrificed for sport…They are sacrificed and then used for food….just like cows, deer, pigs, chicken, fish, turkeys, etc. our ancestors probably killed their animals for food in the same way.
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Kenneth Cutler Harrison
Jews sacrifice animals in respect to the old testament all the time and as Judeo Christians I think we forget the old testament is still law to them God sacrificed his son for use to end the old law but we forget we are returning to that law... Also I know for a fact having worked in Hamtramic legal or not they have been sacrificing animals since the early 2000s... And these animals are not wasted they a portioned some is burned but most is consumed by the observers it's a very reverent and holy observation that isn't any different then the modern acetic Jews around the world
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Stephen Mohlaloga Makgoathane
I, Reverend Stephen Mohlaloga Trevor Makgoathane agree with this ritual practice and have respect for this kind of sacrifices. My point is solely with reference to the old testament ( THE HOLY SCRIPTURES) Where the Old-Man Moses carrying God's instructions to slaughter a RAM. This ritual matter is in the Holy- Bible, absolutely nothing wrong in that.Read Book of Leviticus Chapter 2 and Chapter 3 these phrases are much in support of these kind of Offerings.But, the duties thereof must be done by Priests only. Example" Aaron and his Priests sons. AMEN. Reverend" STEPHEN TREVOR MOHLALOGA MAKGOATHANE ( S.A)
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Although I find this ritual to be more humane than what I know of the meat industry, the nonsense of your biblical hokum is irrelevant. I find the reasoning behind this practice just another example of delusional thinking, yours being an excellent example.
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Amber Fry
People need to relax and THINK about this a minute. Our own commercial farm animals tend not to be treated half as good as what herds and flocks intended for sacrifice are. These animals are treated well, not abused in life, considered blessed and are sacrificed for the good of their god and the people it will feed. I find it odd, especially for those that do eat meat from a supermarket, would balk at this.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
My opinion exactly.
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George Aloyius Gusick, Sr
Pastor George A Gusick Sr
Is it my right to criticize how another church, religion or belief worships their God? I think not.
While I do believe the slashing or the throat of any animal is cruel and repugnant. The worshipers of Islam knew that we had laws in our country against the cruel treatment of animals, all animals. But they chose to relocate to here. What other laws or rules of our society are we going to have to change to accommodate them? I don’t believe that we should change our laws to accommodate another religion, church or belief. So while I give them their right to worship as they choose, I condemn the City Council in that City to change our laws to accommodate their religion.
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Denise A Moody
It doesn’t bother me. As long as the animal is well cared for before the sacrifice and then is humanely slaughtered it’s no different than people dressing out a deer or livestock they’ve killed. I have at least one steer killed and dressed out in front of my barn every year. It’s then taken to a butcher shop. I also kill chickens I’ve specifically raised for meat and older hens and extra roosters. Although not ritually killed they are thanked for providing food for my family. Ritual sacrifice is also an integral part of Santeria.
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Dawn
This is another example of how people hide under the cover of religion to do despicable things. What’s next when a majority religion is in control (we already have taken away a woman’s personal health choices)? Talk to combat vets in Iraq about what they’ve seen: gay men murdered by lynching and left hanging off bridges; little girls and women being raped and murdered; a father killing his daughter just because she had tripped & fallen and a non-Muslim man helped her up. These are facts that those Muslims believe are not just supported by Islam but required by Islam although they’re not. (kind of like old testament xtians?) They have and are still happening although you won’t see it on the media because to disagree with anything remotely ‘religious’ is considered hate speak. We have gotten to the point where we don’t care about integrity and right/wrong but the superficial b.s. like religion, ancestry, gender, sexual/gender orientation…If something is wrong-it’s wrong regardless who did it and what their ‘attributes’ are. We’ve lost our minds.
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Ronald Edward Howlett
Deborah Carr Anderson.
It's good to see anger and bias are still alive and well. When is the last time you ate out? In reply to your deleted post " I guess you'll know when you die.
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Lady Mutt Cat
Animal slaughter for any reason is an abomination. Animal slaughter in the name of religion is even more of an abomination, although the animal involved doesn't care why s/he is being killed. This is a disgusting step backward. Any moral society will outlaw it. Kosher and halal slaughter also need to be stopped. Santeria sacrifice also needs to be stopped. Ritual slaughter is particularly brutal as the animal is awake and aware the entire time. I spit on any religion that practices such abominations.
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Wilberta M. Berry
Animal sacrifice has been in existence ever since Abraham replaced his son Isaac (who he was going to sacrifice for the Lord) until he was stopped. So to ne this is 100 % a useless waste of intelligence to discuss this issue any further. Of course it should be okay. If it was good enough for Abraham who I to judge?
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Lady Mutt Cat
Exactly. A nasty desert warrior god orders a father, whose primary job should have been to protect his child, to kill his kid, and that idiot father agreed to. And then his god said, ha ha, only kidding. Kill this other innocent animal instead. Abraham was a barbarian. His god was a barbarian. End of discussion.
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Gregory SG
If you look you'll find its been around longer then most organized religions' was deemed reverence for a lessor one of the creators beings and of mans total dominance over the beasts and to justify it.
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Linda Salavarria
I had to comment since this is just a bad idea. I don't think these people have thought this out and they want to continue with barbaric religious practices that by now should have evolved into something different and less violent. They needed to think what it will do to their property value and their community as a whole. Think of this: would you want to buy a house where animal sacrifices took place? Would you want to live next door to a person who performs animal sacrifices? Would you want to invest in a community that practices this type of thing?This is not a wise idea for their community and not beneficial for their economic outlook. If the only people that become interested in investing in this neighborhood are the current residents who perform this practice or are ok with it, they're really limiting their resources and I wouldn't be surprised if this area becomes economically distressed ( If it isn't already...). Hey I say this all the time; in ancient Greece there was a practice that was followed where if a child had any kind of damage at birth they would leave it at the side of a mountain to die. Look it up. This is an example of how some practices, religious or otherwise, are just inhumane or outdated and need to evolve. Hopefully the federal government will step in and create some kind of law that overrules this one.
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David Lee Valdina
I have not read the many previous posts. This may have been addressed. Separation of church and state seems to me to not allow a requirement that
"there are also guardrails in place; residents will reportedly have to notify the city if they plan to perform a sacrifice, as well as pay a fee and make their property available for inspection."
Imagine the outrage if the city required the city to approve of the wine for communion and disallowed it be given to minors.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Don't y'all think it's fun to watch crabs boiling in a pot of water? You know, it's always best to throw them in alive!
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Ruth Aída Percowicz
I was wondering what would have happened if a Jewish City Council did the same thing?
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
I love eating lamb, but can't afford it! If somebody offers me free lamb I don't care where they got it, or what they did to it. It will taste just as good to me!
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
That's right, tuppenny, but atleast they're not skinning them alive while listening to Bach's Taccotta and Fugue in D minor.
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Marcella J Schieffelin
Ritual (religious) slaughter is slaughter done according to the religious requirements of either the Jewish or Muslim religious faith. The animal is slaughtered, without being stunned, with a razor sharp knife. When the cut is done correctly, the animal appears not to feel it. From an animal welfare standpoint, the major concern during ritual (religious) slaughter are the stressful and cruel methods of restraint (holding) that are used in some plants. Progressive slaughter plants use devices to hold the animal in a comfortable, upright position. Unfortunately, there are some plants which use cruel methods of restraint such as hanging live animals upside down. At Grandin Livestock Systems, we believe that the practice of hanging live cattle and calves upside down should be eliminated. For both humane and safety reasons, plants which conduct ritual (religious) slaughter should install modern upright restraining equipment. There are many different types of humane restraint devices available.
https://www.grandin.com/ritual/rec.ritual.slaughter.html
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Animals apparently don’t feel pain like humans so a razor sharp knife across the throat is likely a relatively speaking ‘non event’ for them. And given they lack the understanding of having their throat cut, the warmness on their chest and legs as blood gushes out isn’t concerning. They’ll just pass out from lack of blood flow to the brain.
Back in the 70s I rented a farmhouse for my guy that, among other things, raised pigs. I was out and about one morning, and someway ended up with him down at the pigpen. Maybe you wanted my help but regardless, I ended up helping nut some pigs, which is to say remove their testicles. My job is to hold their little legs open and pin down their chest. He would take a razor or an extremely sharp knife make two slits on the scrotum region side with his index and middle fingers pull out the nuts, slice through the vas deferens, toss the nuts in a bucket give them a quick spray of some kind of antiseptic, an injection of vitamins and some of that stuff, toss them on the ground and let them run to Mama. Sounds kind of cruel, but it makes for a better tasting meat.
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Lady Mutt Cat
Nonhuman animals experience pain and fear just as you and I do. Being an apologist for this filth doesn't go very far with those of us who know better.
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Lady Mutt Cat
Temple Grandin is one of the worst excuses for a human that I know of. Her evil plan to make murder more acceptable is disgusting. If she really gave a damn about animals, she'd be leading the movement to a vegan lifestyle.
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Marcella J Schieffelin
I’m shocked by your very strong language regarding your feelings around Temple Grandin. I understand your value of choosing to be vegan. Just because you disagree with someone else’s values doesn’t mean they are not a worthy human being. “Evil plan” is a judgment and there is a difference between murdering and killing. I get this is emotionally charged for you. I invite you to agree to disagree without stripping someone of dignity and to explore that perhaps she is doing what she believes is right by pointing out how the industry could do better in treatment of animals. Hate is started by people using language to demean another person.
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Pastor Jody S.
I'm old enough to remember when most of us lived in an area where we would have enough land to have a garden. Quite a few of us also kept poultry, rabbits, or some goats. Families that had more land would keep a small dairy herd, and then have their own milk to drink and sell the excess to dairy co-ops.
We kep chickens for fresh eggs, and we would have chicken meat after the first few year when the egg production of hens would inevitably dip. Mom handled the rendering, as well as the cooking. Prior to WW II, our nations population that did not live in the city did this, too.
Fast forward to today, and people are aghast to discover animals being butchered, and eaten. Apparantly, no one ever wondered where all of the Chicken McNuggets came from - until now.
Here in the US we are truly blessed to not need to participate in the constant "Struggle for Food", unlike most of the world. The fact that a community composed of a Non-Christian group of citizens wants to butcher animals, eat the meat at their family meal, and then share it with the less-advantaged members of the community, shouldn't really be anyone else's business. It's no different than what Mom, or most of our neighbor's did, 60 years ago.
Or to put this another way, if this was the local Knights of Columbus council cooking ribs for a Catholic Parish picnic, we wouldn't hear a peep about the poor pigs.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
I like your closing statement. Very true. Xtians will alway jump on any train bound for persecuting other religions.
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Colleen McAllister
No Dr Z CHRISTIANS will not jump on any train as you put it. Most of us do not persecute others. We may disagree but do not go any farther than that. Many of us show respect for others while still opposing those beliefs. I am sorry that you feel that calling people names or refusing to use proper names for religions makes you feel superior. Are you so afraid of religion that you cannot even spell out Christian?
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Daniel Gray
So for all of the people whining about this, maybe they should look up this SCOTUS decision that says this is clearly acceptable Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah 1993
" Related cases in Free Exercise of Religion
In Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah, 508 U.S. 520 (1993), the Supreme Court affirmed the principle that laws targeting specific religions violate the free exercise clause of the First Amendment. Florida city banned animal sacrifices after church planned to build a house of worship
The Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye practices Santeria, a fusion of traditional African religions and Roman Catholicism.
After the church announced plans to establish a house of worship in Hialeah, Florida, the city council enacted four ordinances prohibiting the ritual sacrifice of animals, a ceremony Santerians perform to express devotion to their spirits.Court said city had violated the First Amendment and targeted religion
The church filed suit, and a federal district court ruled for the city. The Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals affirmed.
The Supreme Court unanimously reversed the Eleventh Circuit, holding that the city had targeted and sought to suppress a religious practice in violation of the free exercise clause. Court used Smith test to determine religious freedom violation
In the opinion for the Court, Justice Anthony M. Kennedy cited the two-part test articulated in Employment Division, Department of Human Resources of Oregon v. Smith (1990): The government may burden religious practice if a law is neutral and generally applicable.
Applying the first element of the Smith test, Kennedy declared that Hialeah’s ordinances were not neutral; rather, the record revealed that the city council had sought to suppress the Santerians’ ritual sacrifice of animals.
The city claimed that the ordinances promoted public health and prevented cruelty to animals, but applying the second prong of the Smith test, Kennedy held that the ordinances were not generally applicable.
The ordinances granted exceptions for slaughterhouses, and they did not require the inspection of fish or game caught by hunters, the control of food disposed of by restaurants, or prohibit the killing of animals for nonreligious reasons, including the catching of fish and the extermination of mice and rats. Court said law did not serve a compelling government interest
A law that fails the Smith test must be justified by a compelling governmental interest and be narrowly tailored to achieve that interest. Kennedy held that the Hialeah ordinances were not compelling, because they were underinclusive with respect to animal and public health interests.
They also were not narrowly tailored to serve those interests, because they were either overbroad or underinclusive. Concurring opinions questioned use of Smith test for free exercise cases
In a concurrence, Justice David H. Souter expressed his disagreement with the use of the Smith test.
He argued that the Court should reexamine Smith, because it was atypical of the Court’s free exercise jurisprudence and because Smith, having left prior cases undisturbed, also left unresolved the issue of which constitutional rule to follow in deciding free exercise cases.
Justice Harry A. Blackmun concurred with Souter that Smith was wrongly decided and that the Hialeah ordinances violated the free exercise clause, because laws that target religion are not tailored to serve a compelling governmental interest.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
That looked long. Did you have to switch hands? You know, to write that?
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Don't worry, Zerpersande, Daniel doesn't have anything better to do.
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Lionheart
I wonder if anyone actually read it? 🤷🏼
John Parkin has a similar issue with verbal diarrhea. It just won’t stop when it starts.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
It's not just John Partin, Lionheart. His sister Dolly can't stop singing iether. It makese wonder if both of those personalities possess the same body, If not, maybe their whole family just can't shutup.
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Lionheart
All I know is….I love the smell of bacon in the morning. I mean….real…thick…British bacon, not the American tissue paper bacon with hardly any meat. Just don’t tell me where it came from, or how is passed away. 🐖🐷
Bacon, and eggs….mmmm….I bet you can you smell it right now… just by reading it. 🥓🍳
Heaven!
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Robert Edward Szekely
The question becomes is it necessary to re-enact a ritual from centuries ago, instead of symbolically recognizing it? Do Christians find a man as a proxy for Jesus and nail him to a cross every Christmas to re-enact the crucifixion? What about Passover? Are Jews smearing lamb's blood over their doorways? You can honor your history without literally re-enacting it: you can do so symbolically in memory of its significance to your faith. Maybe we should all go back to living in the desert in tents, huts and cabins without electricity and plumbing as well, if we want to be purists.
Let us try not to forget the progress and maturation that comes with the civilizing of a society. Religion is not immutable.
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Alun Lloyd Palmer
Most of us eat meat. We mostly also don't want to see the slaughter done. I know I don't. The real issue is I suppose whether it is done humanely.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
I hope they don't run them tails first through a meat grinder, while they're still alive. Try to imagine that.
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John P Maher
IN GOD WE TRUST, W T F ???
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
John, are you saying you aren't familiar with the term, or trusting in God is something you would never do?
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Rev Ned
That “In God we trust” and “Under God” stuff was added in the 1950s when we were in the Cold War against the “Godless” Commies. Kinda anachronistic ain’t it?
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Nicholas J Page
I'm against ritual slaughter after all all creatures are God's animals . Muslim laws suck they can kill humans without a thought for anyone but themselves Get into the 21st century and leave the barbaric treatment in the past where it belongs.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Which god told you that you had to be a vegan or vegetarian, Nicholas. All that meat they sell in store didn't grow on trees, but came from dead animals that were killed by people. And a simple slit of the throat is far more humane than the ordeals those animals go through in slaughterhouses.
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Nicholas J Page
I'm against ritual slaughter after all all creatures are God's animals . Muslim laws suck they can kill humans without a thought for anyone but themselves Get into the 21st century and leave the barbaric treatment in the past where it belongs.
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Jimmy Moon
Comment has been removed.
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Marcella J Schieffelin
I sure hope you consider changing your language and choice of words, Jimmy Moon. Your derogatory and hurtful language is not welcome.
As one human being to another, i sincerely hope you reflect upon your choice of words and choose to use words that create connection and peace, rather than words that do the opposite. This is no place for hate speech.
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Marcella J Schieffelin
I sure hope you choose to change your choice of words and language Jimmy Moon. Your derogatory and hurtful language is not welcome here.
There is no place here for hate speech of any kind.
I believe you wanted to identify Muslims who have been elected to office.
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Rev Ned
Is Sharia law next??
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Joe Stutler
You mean Abrahamic law? Yeah, the gullible believe magical sky fairies dictate rules for us. They're wrong, because they're stupid.
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Ealdormon Piparskeggr Robinson
As I recall the Supreme Court of the United Stated ruled in 1993 that laws forbidding ritual sacrifice are unconstitutional. I think it was a case of a Santeria temple versus the city of Hialeah, FL.
So, as I understand, PETA's objections are moot.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
"This is when Muslims recognize Abraham sacrificing a sheep instead of having to sacrifice his son.”
Yep, isn’t god great? Need to watch Louis CK’s ‘God is like a bad girlfriend’. God wakes Abraham up in the the middle of the night to yank ol’ Abraham’s chain a bit. ‘Go murder your son.’
THIS is the male bovine fecal matter that the religiously delusional celebrate. Suppose you’re on a jury in a trial where a father murdered his son. Says god told him to do it. Gonna’ find him innocent? But god TOLD him to do it.
Idiocy
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Clay Serenbetz
Muslim countries, such as Iran and Afghanistan, purportedly make human sacrifice and evidence exists of beheading. This murder for sacrifice is a part of their culture. While Americans don't slaughter the animals in their homes, turkeys, lamb and beef are often slaughtered for celebratory or religious feasts. The slaughtering humans is viewed as barbaric in most countries. Animals are essentially slaughtered for religious purpose all the time. It's just a matter of who does the slaughtering and how. As stated already by Spindler, animals are slaughtered in the U.S. all the time. See: https://www.wired.com/2009/05/b-1-video-shows-taliban-human-sacrifice-military-says/
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
obviously an anti-muslim bias, if crschins decided they wanted to sacrifice a bull or a child the entire crschin industry would be behind it, the goopers, and the crschin nationalist supreme crschin court of the united states would rule in their favor. but muslims....no, no, no, crschins are anti-muslim, anti- everything that's not their particular flavor of crschins
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Douglas Robert Spindler
Foster Farms, hunters and fisherman do this everyday. Why is it when Muslims do it Christians have a fit?
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Daniel Gray
And WHO exactly said that PETA was a christian organization? Seems this is only in your biased mind.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Daniel Gray This is just another attack by Christians against Muslims masked by PETA. Christians will always create or join a cause if it's any attack against Muslims, women, people of color, LGBTQ+ and similar issues.
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Daniel Gray
and you are full of it. The SCOTUS has already ruled that this is legal and the muslum city council is clearly not christian so only you would know why you decided to claim it is.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Daniel Gray Why is this even an issue then? Simple, it's because Christians are always looking for ways to attack Christians.
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Daniel Gray
what part of the city council is mostly muslum do you intentionally not understand?
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Daniel Gray
No the issue is that you seems to want to attack Christians no matter what and this time it came back and slapped you upside the head.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Daniel Gray I want to attack Christians? Christians have been attacking non-Christians since before I was born. It's always the Christians who are looking for a fight. Why can't they live in peace and let others live in peace?
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Daniel Gray
I can say the same thing about every other religion up to and including atheists and humanists. So what exactly is your point that is if you have one?
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Daniel Gray Yes can we can say it about other religions, but there's one difference. Christians are more vocal and violent about it. Christians have no problem demonizing, attacking and killing people in the name of their religion. Other religions just don't do that.
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Daniel Gray
Really? And I guess you miss the point where the SCOTUS has ruled Atheism and Humanism are RELIGIONS and just a look at history shows that Atheism has killed far more people then the first three religions COMBINED.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Daniel Gray You are correct I did miss the where the SCOTUS ruled Atheism and Humanism are RELIGIONS. What's the name of the ruling and when did it take place?
You are defiantly wrong when you say Atheism has killed far more people then the first three religions COMBINED if your religious are beliefs are life begins at conception. We know God kills 75% to 80% of the lives God creates. Or if you are a non-believer nature is the killer. In that case I would agree with you. It all depends on what you believe.
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Joe Stutler
Because they're Christians... that's how they roll
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Joe Stutler
Humane slaughter is a time-tested method of butchering. The ones most likely to whine about this are the cannibal cultists who believe magic turns a cracker into human flesh ..those are the truly sick nutters. Enjoy your lamb/goat/etc, folks...good eatin' on them. 😉
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Nope, they’re both groups of nutters. Other than that, agree with the method being humane. Well, as humane as one can get catching a creature and killing it.
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tuppennyblue
The method is NOT 'humane': we are talking about ritual slaughter, where the animals are not stunned before their throats are cut.
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Ahmed Abduljabar Al-Hujazi
When looking at the actual act itself all three of major monotheistic faiths agree that slicing the arteries, if done properly, does not cause any more pain than the impact of pressure driven hammer. In both cases there is a brief moment of pain, then death follow quickly.
And as far as PETA is concerned, their hypocrisy is well shown, when one observes them eating burgers at lunch.-
Debra Hunt
I meant to vote NO!!!! For thousands of years human sacrifice was normal religious practice. How do you know cutting a throat is painless? I would think it’s painful and difficult. PETA has saved millions of lives. Also vegetarianism helps the planet by reducing carbon emissions. NO to murdering innocent lives. Look at those kind faces. I have never seen a PETA member eating meat burgers. Post any pictures you have of PETA members eating meat burgers.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
That's right, tuppenny, but atleast they're not skinning them alive while listening to Bach's Taccotta and Fugue in D minor.
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Daniel Gray
No BOTH of you are nutters, the Supreme Court has already ruled this is part of a persons religion Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah so tough too bad, you both lose.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
I don’t give an airborne rodent’s anal sphincter muscle what a city council has ‘ruled’. The council is a Muslim majority, of COURSE they will use any chance to pass religiously delusional beliefs into law. But here I actually agree with them. My grandfather used to slaughter rabbits he raised. Grabbed them by the back legs, whacked them over the back of the head HARD, hung them upside down on a board by slipping protruding nails behind their Achilles tendons and sliced their bodies open with a razor sharp picket knife I still have next to me now.
I said that ‘they’ (xtians and Muslims) were both equally qualified as nutters.
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Lady Mutt Cat
Try to pay attention. The case that Gray cites is a SUPREME COURT case.
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Colleen McAllister
My approval or acceptance does not change the law. Nor does my disapproval. After all do not most if us "sacrifice" a turkey at Thanksgiving? Or a pig for our Christmas ham?
As long as the sacrifice is done within the laws and limits set then I see no problem with it. Like it? No. But my likes and dislikes have no bearing on the law.
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JaZe
😕 At a time when we should be scaling back meat consumption? Religious freedom cannot equate with cruelty, in fact religions need to adapt to modern thinking! Islam is stuck in 6th century thought and attitude! What is their next thing?
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
“ At a time when we should be scaling back meat consumption?” Your opinion.
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Katelynne Shouse
NO NO NO....animal sacrifice has ZERO in common with a modern society. I don't care what any religion says it should be OUTLAWED. PERIOD!
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Oh, come on! These sacrifices are only small versions of what happens to pigs, cows, chickens, turkeys, etc every day on a MASSIVE scale. And from what I have read about the large scale operations, an animal clueless about the nature of these weird humans leading them out behind the house has a much less traumatic experience.
Now if you don’t eat meat, that’s another matter. You are in with the PETA gang. Don’t agree with you though. But at least you aren’t a dimwitted hypocrite.
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Lady Mutt Cat
I'm a vegan and basically agree that it's all about the same. And it's all barbaric. I'm happy to be in with that "PETA gang."
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
But the human sacrifice of Jesus is ok?
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
And don't forget the cannibalism of eating his flesh and drinking his blood.
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Rev, Rene L.
Good one!!! Edible paper wafers and bad cheap wine is not the body and blood of Christ. But of course, next: the same people who said pot is the first step to heroin will be baying and frothing at the mouth saying human sacrifice will be next. I just hope they will eat the goats and sheep they kill, as the people who ritually kill chickens in places like Haiti do. In the meantime, I will live my life as before, with my religious choices, and they can practice their beliefs. Love and tolerance for all mankind?
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Rev. B
Rene, please look up transubstantiation. Enjoy!
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This form of slaughter is brutal as the animal watches its blood drain from its neck. This is the 21st century and customs and practices need to move with the times. A real sacrifice would be to go without animal sourced protein.