Is this mural promoting Satanism? You be the judge.
A high school sophomore in Grant, Michigan won a contest to design a mural for a local middle school health center.
The teen was instructed to include “smiling children” and to promote a “stay healthy” message. By all indications, she followed the prompt.
However, not everyone is a fan of the various artistic liberties she took.
Some local parents are outraged at what they claim is a pro-LGBTQ message that is discriminatory towards Christians… as well as some hidden demonic messages. Now, what was intended to be a simple and wholesome message of inclusion by the artist has turned into a flashpoint of controversy for this small Michigan town.
Spot the Satanism
“I put my art up there to make people feel welcome,” explained the artist at a local school board meeting earlier this month.
But some say that the mural is inappropriate because it contains pro-LGBTQ symbols.
For example, one child on the mural is wearing a t-shirt with the transgender pride flag on it. Another student in the mural is in a shirt bearing the colors of the bisexual pride flag, and another is wearing rainbow leggings.
Other critics turned their focus on something far darker: supposed symbols of Satanism that appear in the design.
Their two main concerns:
1) A demonic-looking face that is incorporated into the center-left of the mural (which the creator says is just a symbol from the popular video game Genshin Impact)
2) A Hamsa hand (a sign of spiritual protection in many cultures) that is tucked away on the left side of the painting.
Those last two points led to accusations of witchcraft against the teenage artist.
"I feel like she did a really good job finding excuses to defend the things she put on," said a local woman, Katelyn Thompson, at the school board meeting. "None of us are that stupid."
Another local woman, Danielle Beight, said that the transgender flag on the mural was tantamount to promoting mental illness in children. "When adults pretend things that are like real life, it's a mental illness,” she said. “We need counselors, we need medication that's going to help bipolar disorder, fix their brains."
And one man actually accused the mural of being a message of hate toward Christians.
"We and our administration should embrace that and get all of this hate material out of our schools,” said Nate Thompson at the school board meeting. “Because it is hate material."
Is the Mural Immoral?
Despite the grievances of many, some students and parents came to the mural’s defense.
"I am a conservative, right-wing, gun-loving American," said a local woman named Tracy Hargreaves. "But I've never seen more bigoted people in my life. We have an array of people in this little town, and I'll be the first one to support our Christian families. But we're not the only ones here."
Another student who identifies as queer explained that, as someone who is bullied in school, the mural makes them feel included and seen. Directing their comments toward outraged parents, they said “maybe you should be more concerned with your children's behaviors, instead of what art is on the wall.”
After the meeting, the district announced that they’ve reached an agreement with the artist to remove certain elements that weren’t part of the initial design pitch, like the "demonic" mask and the Hamsa hand. The LGBTQ symbols – which were part of the initial design, and were approved previously – will remain.
Citing their commitment to “civility, respect, understanding and inclusion,” the school says they simply will not tolerate “discrimination, harassment or bullying whether in word, deed or on social media.”
What do you think? Were the symbols appropriate for a school mural, and were the reactions from local parents inappropriate?
191 comments
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Shelley Rene' Stewart-Stevens
The people of Grant, MI should read this:
The Hamsa Hand is an ancient symbol that has been around for at least 1800 years and pre-dates all the major religions. It first originated in ancient Mesopotamia (present-day Iraq) and Carthage (present-day Tunisia). The word “hamsa” comes from the Hebrew word “hamesh,” which means five. Hamsa refers to the fact that there are five fingers on the talisman, though some also believe it represents the five books of the Torah (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy). Sometimes it is called the Hand of Miriam, who was Moses’ sister1.
The Hamsa Hand symbolizes protection, warding off evil and keeping the user safe. It also represents luck, guidance, feminine power, and faith among other meanings 23.
https://www.bing.com/search?pglt=673&q=how+long+has+the+hamsa+hand+been+around&cvid=dbb59322e125436a845f1f0d1ad6e24d&aqs=edge..69i57j0l8.19969j0j1&FORM=ANNTA1&DAF1=1&PC=EDGEDSE
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Pastor George Day
Shelley Rene' Stewart-Stevens,
Your link doesn't lead anywhere.
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Mary Haviland
of course it is satanic, if it goes against the bible, its satanic, and should never be taught to children that age.
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Paul Edward Nunis
Well... the animals all have clothes on, so it should be OK in Tennessee. ;-)
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Rev Ned
IMHO, children are safer with a bunch of LGBQT+ people than they are with a bunch of evangelical preachers or Catholic priests.
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Matthew Derek Nelson
this is bullying, plain and simple. does the bible not teach these so-called believers that they should be kind? be welcoming? seek to improve people's lives rather than control them? Romans 14: 1-4 says: "As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand."
who cares if the kids want to have LGBTQ-friendly veggies on their plate? IT'S THEIR PLATE, NOT THE PTA'S. the parents don't have to live 8 hours a day 5 days a week in that building with everything around them influencing their behaviors and whatnot, the kids do. if they feel the need to comfort their friends by including them in the decor, I don't see where any sensible person would have a problem with it so long as nobody's getting pushed out to make room, and as far as i can tell by the article above, nobody is. they just want to be in charge of what everyone else is allowed to do, say, see, and like. also the Hanya mask being called satanic just reeks of xenophobia, honestly. educate the parents if you can, maybe they'll get lucky and change a few hearts and minds.
love your neighbors, folks!
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Rev. Terence Barry AC. OCC.
The only thing evil about this is the small minded individuals who look for anything in a picture or comment and deem it Satanic . My understanding of the words of Jesus Christ, is Love one another as I love you . Love being the main word . Jesus's words are all about love, not hate . Hate is a symbol of evil. Those who engage in hatred towards others are not followers of Christ, but servants of Satan. How can the love of two people whether two men or two women be a threat to anyone , what is so frightening about love? I know several gay couples who've had life long relationships longer than relationships of straight couples. These gay couples celebrated marriage , they have children , it's a fact that children brought up in a family with same sex parents have a better chance of college and university because of the love and attention given to them by both parents, and the surrogate mother almost usually a close friend or relative is always never too far away . Surely God does not make mistakes when He creates Homosexual people , there is a reason for their creation, not just in the human species but in the natural world, animal kingdom, and sea life .. Same sex relationships can help reduce the population , if so many gay men hadn't been executed by Christians or Muslims over the centuries , the population may not be almost 11 billion. One in every nine men are gay . If they were left alone to be themselves and not forced into a love less marriage with a woman have children , the balance of human population wouldn't be so off .. God knew what He was doing when He created Homosexuals. The animal kingdom population hasn't exploded nor the sea life. Because nature was allowed to take its course , the work of God . But the words of God have been misrepresented via third party scripts and rewritten by scribes using different language Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek and Latin, meaning words can mean something different when rewriting from Hebrew to Greek and from Greek to Latin and then from Latin to modern English . There is absolutely no reference in the holy scriptures condemning homosexuality, yes there is something which states sometbing like *man can not sleep with man as man sleeps with woman *.. but gay men don't sleep with women, they don't sleep with man the way other men may with women . Therefore this has no connection with homosexuality.. maybe Bisexuality .. ? Because bisexuals do sleep with men similar to the way they sleep with women. But not the same. I wonder if these people who condemned this painting as satanic ever ate Shellfish because according to the holy scriptures eating shellfish is an Abomination, do they wear two different types of material clothing at the one time. Because it's an Abomination. Are they divorced? That too is an Abomination. Jesus died at 33 years old. Unmarried apparently, although there is other writings by His brother to claim he was married and had a son and at least one daughter . The bloodline of Jesus is probably amongst us today.. but anyway sticking with the old church stories Jesus died at 33 , unmarried, and spent his whole adult life eating , traveling, chatting and sleeping amongst men .. today such a man would be labled Gay ..
So, In my opinion those who call this painting satanic are lost in their own misdeeds and just lash out because it is all they know how to deal with things . These people would probably have the statue of David removed.. Art is Art which is a gift from God.. once again these people insult God by mocking His gifts and His creations ..
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Minister of Peace
I am saddened by this story. I applaud the artist and her vision to be all inclusive and lend a voice to those who may feel silenced. Middle school years can be the most difficult for many young people. It is a time when preteens and young teens are working toward defining themselves and understanding themselves. They are trying to figure out where they fit into the world around them. Shame on those adults who dismiss and shame the Artist and the students who may have felt seen and understood in a space where they spend several years. “Grownups” sure do mess up a lot.
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Nathan Weitzel
I'd be more concerned with the demon mask under the kid in the Santa coat (top middle left) or the frog faces that look like Pepe the frog...the new symbol of racism.
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William I. Hegeman
No. There is nothing satanic in that picture.
Controlling is less of an issue as is the projection of fear. Fear built up in evangelical and alt-right communities projected over and over again infecting people and society. As they say a persons reaction says more about them than what they are reacting to.
There is LGBTQ+ colors and some of the kids clothes, in a High School, acceptance for what who people are even as children is awesome. For those who don't know, it is just colored clothing. Animal heads, on anthropomorphic shaped bodies. Is Winnie the Pooh and piglet demonic, no. Are Anime cartoons demonic, while there themed manga that may be so, but in this art, definitely no.
Jesus, if that is what one believes in, spent time with publicans and sinners. What does any city have? They have a conclave of the disenfranchised. The same LGBTQIA+, poly, and others who would have been stoned and or outright murdered in their small town villages. Communities and parents that ostracize children and others and they gravitate toward accepting communities. The story of Jesus asking the woman at the well how were her husbands (plural) is an example. She denied it. What was the sin that Jesus rebuked her for, it wasn't polyandry, it was lying. Lying, the denial of truth.
For people so afraid of anything demonic or satanic, have they ever seen or felt the presence of a real demon? Have they ever performed an exorcism? The rebuking of their own vices of smoke and drink, are not demons. I have performed successful exorcisms. And I gladly tell people that I have, and they do not know what they are talking about what is Satanic. The prevalent places, and it is exceptional rare there also, where possession or satanic influences come from, is in the very hyper religious communities, that project this fear, but occurs in people who have already been physically, psychologically and or sexually abused in their own community. It is their own community they to root their own evil. Watching demons dance with those ecstatically dancing in churches while proclaiming their holieness believing that Jesus forgives them everything, all their reoccuring sins, are just feeding demons. They haven't read nor understood this scripture Mark 3:20-23, and it is repeated in the other synoptic gospels. Sadly Satan already owns many of them, or at least they are bereft of the heavenly entrance that they believe they have.
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Amy Varela
Ignorant snowflakes, that's what the detractors are. A bunch of immature, bigoted, whiny snowflakes. FFS, even the self-proclaimed conservative, right-wing gun lover realizes they are being stupid.
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Deirdre M. Walker
Why can't children just be children. Their brains are still developing. They're learning how to be nice to others, how to share, how to deal with confluct, how to play, etc. Why would anyone want to sexualize innocent children at such young ages. My goodness, what is going on?
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Theresa Gull
People are killing me with this kind of nonsense.
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Devin Lewis Woods
It's a mural. Who cares? Are they worried their child will become gay because they see a rainbow or possessed because there's a demon head? and what's wrong with the hamsa hand? F ALL THE WAY OFF.
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Devin Lewis Woods
It's a mural. Who cares? Are they worried their child will become gay because they see a rainbow or possessed because there's a demon head? and what's wrong with the hamsa hand? F*** ALL THE WAY OFF.
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Lady Mutt Cat
That rabbit with a syringe is clearly promoting IV drug use. Why wasn’t that pointed out and condemned?
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Nathan Weitzel
I think that's meant to promote covid vaccines
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Chris Cunningham
The satanic face? Looks like an Oni mask from Japanese culture. There's also Hello Kitty, and a "cat"erpillar.
"discriminatory towards Christians" apparently now means that it is inclusive of other cultures and faiths. I see the Hamsa hand, and I see a lotus flower, along with the symbol for peace. If you want to find fault in something by selecting individual icons, you are forcing yourself to divorce those symbols and icons from those around it. The supposed satanic face is literally adjacent to the peace symbol.
I shouldn't even have to complain about people having issues with the rainbow leggings (never mind the matching shirt). If that is somehow offensive to you, clearly you're not mature enough to remember Rainbow Brite. That was the first thing I thought of when I saw it.
It takes a particular world view to think everyone is against you, and find fault in everything. Something that is inclusive of multiple cultures and symbology, note the individual in the center with a head scarf. This is an inclusive piece, and if being inclusive is viewed as anti-anything, then the fault lies with those feeling they are on the receiving end of that anti-sentiment.
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Lu-Ann Monterville
Yes it's Satanic all the symbols are there
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Daniel Todd Kamm
She did a beautiful piece from her heart, showing love for all kinds of people. Her critics need to heal their own hearts. Reb tk
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Terri Lynn Rose
In the article one person says we are not stupid and to that I say: " No, just ignorant and judgemental. I wonder what would Jesus say? " And please bipolar meds, counseling that comment or must be suffering from the detrimental side effects of Big Pharma ! Seeing things that are not there due to fear and ignorance can lead to some forms of mental illness. Perhaps some counseling for the judging ones to find out what they fear in the illustration; and why would be more appropriate?
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Angela Guyton-Cyril
I am happy that a child can see the world without so much hate. How many adults can say they see the world like that? A child sees the unity that we can bring.
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Mitchell Harwood
People see what they want to see. If they want to "the devil" in Japanese anime cartoons, then they will see that. It says more about the parents mental disorders and hang-ups than it does about about the artist or young people in general.
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Rev. Rory
The hamsa is a depiction of a human hand, often, though not always, with a central eye motif.
The symbol is widely used across much of the Middle East and North Africa The Hebrew word hamesh means five, as does the Arabic word khamsah. In Muslim traditions, it is sometimes known as the Hand of Fatima, named for one of the prophet Muhammad's daughters, according to Frankel. In some Christian usages, it is referred to as the Hand of Mary. It's an image recognized and used as a sign of protection at many times and in many cultures throughout history, traditionally believed to provide defense against the evil eye, a powerful notion in many of those cultures.
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Marcy Reynolds Cunningham
The Mural s a collective, beautiful, wondrous piece of ART. It reeks of LOVE and connection.
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James P. Applegate
OK. For people not watching Disney as u can see clearly some designs are from many Disney Shows. The Hand with the eye is from Gravity Falls, the bottom left with Frog and Caterpillar Cat is also Disney show Annphibian, then the signs which people think it's witchcraft well again another Disney Show called Owl House. Like I said look at it don't judge it. It is amazing!!!
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Rolland Pitzer
It’s time for people to get a life. As a Christian I am tired of these so called Christians so pious that it’s their way or the highway. This has gotten entirely out of hand I wonder what they would think if they saw the artwork in the Vatican. I have and it covers every corner of religious view of good and evil but I don’t see them picking on the masters but sure as hell can pick on a kid. You should be ashamed of yourselves and I believe that you might be in for a rude awakening when it’s your turn to meet your maker. It’s very clear in revelations when it talks about people that claim to be Jews ( Christians) who are not. You should be asking for forgiveness and maybe you can get a break but you have become so mean and bitter I seriously doubt that you will change. You wonder why people are turning away from the church do you think Jesus had a problem with the poor the sick or the ones not of his persuasion. Listen to the children after all they are gods favorite
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Michael Andrew Smith
All people have a belief system to help answer the question, "Why am I alive and what meaning does my life have?" Some of the most hateful people were and are those with deeply held religions who cannot accept any deviation from their "one and only true religion"
Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, and all the rest are not the end all but attempts to answer those questions of why. It amazes me how hurtful, hateful, unbending such peaceful people can be when their religion is threatened!
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Burruss Scott Williams
I am going to contact the local Chamber of Commerce and report the local Muffler Shop. They must be Satanists. When I picked up my truck (muffler and tailpipe replacement) on October 31, the last 3 igits on the odometer were "666". Then I remembered the service manager had one of those goatees and to top it off they were playing "country music" on the radio. Satanic muffler installers, I knew it
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Lady Mutt Cat
Country music is unforgivable. Thank you for reporting them. It’s not satanic, just an affront to the ears.
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Burruss Scott Williams
as a retired teacher I wish more parents were concerned with their own kids behavior, how many times did I meet with parents about their child bulling other students or other anti social behavior. the old standby, "come on, he(or she) was only joking, people have to learn to take a joke, kids have to toughen up, its a hard world out there",
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Tony Walter Parlato
Do people realize that anything deemed ‘satanic’ is actually Christian? It is, after all a Christian construct born of the Bible they prop up with great zeal. So… any notion of a devil or Satan is purely Christian. So, what are they ACTUALLY in favor of?
So many people are worrying about protecting their prescious children from exposure to anything ‘other’ instead of educating them on thinking through these instances and framing them as learning experiences. Exposure to something does not mean condoning that something. In fact, when you take literature as an example, can’t you argue that schools are trying to get their students to have a new sacrifice ceremony in town, because they are reading and analyzing ‘the lottery’? Get a grip you righteous bigots..
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Daniel George Edward Mulhern
The curse of Babel is perfect and unassailable.
Truth is in the heart alone.
Absolutely NO symbol, word or belief is, or could ever be: Truth!!!
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ronald
people try to read to much into about any thing I say it is good let it lieI don't believe she had any intension to do any thing other then the school ask for.
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Mary
Wish I new how to vote up these nice people and comments they are leaving. There's nothing evil about this mural. No satan and these people posting don't know anything about satan. This is pure superstion and that's all. Stop gaslighting people.
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Minister Jeannine of the Church of the Free Spirit
I think some people are just religious extremists who insist on spreading their ignorance! I recall being told my Yin Yang symbol was a sign of satanism, and that the same throng they told the Native Americans about their culture and spirituality just as "they" have gone around the globe destroying cultures not like theirs and reimagine them into their specific culture and religion! It's shameful!!! To These religious nuts, I say get over yourselves, the world doesn't evolve around your personal beliefs and religion!
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Lori-Ann Neeb
I agree. The Vatican is guilty of heinous acts against innocent people throughout history. Just so we remember God had nothing to do with those acts. Corrupt men who made up the church were totally responsible as we are responsible for our actions to this day. The term Christian applied to someone living Jesus true teachings no matter what church building they enter or not is a person living a true spiritual life. It is those, like history's Vatican, commiting atrocities out of hatred but trying to use God to justify them, that have no right to the title "Christian."
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Cindy L Edgar
I'm pagan I do not worship the devil like all the Christians think that we do the Christians should look at their own selves in the mirror before they start judging everybody else or judging paganism I'm I am so tired of people supposed people especially the Christians judging paganism as a satanic thing we don't worship demons we don't worship Satan paganism has been around a lot longer than Christianity so I would start judging Christianity if I was everyone they're the ones that made sacrifices to people that didn't believe in one God and only one God they're the ones that have the witches killed and sentenced to death for no reason at all so start judging Christianity cuz I do
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Loren William Kinzel
"All the Christians" think that you worship the devil? Now I must say Paganism doesn't have quite the "brand recognition" that Christianity does, but the basic principles of paganism were in my grade school textbooks in the late 60's / early 70's. No devil or human sacrifice mentioned. Like all other walks of life, not all Christians think alike. Boebert & Marge Greene are news. we hear about them. If a man walking down the street hears preaching that he disagrees with but keeps his mouth shut, we don't hear about it as it is not news that sells. So don't judge me by the idiots you see in the news.
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Lady Mutt Cat
I doubt that you are. If you were, you would capitalize Pagan and Witch as you do Christian. Your lack of respect for MY religion is duly noted.
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Lady Mutt Cat
Comment removed by user.
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Pastor George Day
Cindy L Edgar,
Your caricatures of Christianity in what you claim is history does a disservice to the truth. Just enrol on a Cheitian history course, please. As for paganism worshiping demons, this is a simple objective fact. What you call 'gods' are what the Bible refers to as 'the Sons of God,' aka fallen angels.
Again, a bit of education wouldn' hurt :-)
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William McMillian
There is a much larger issue. Separation of church and state. The pilgrims came to avoid persecution by the Church of England. And here we are seeing “Christians” trying to impose their beliefs on others. Wake up Christ was not a blue-eyed Max von Sydow. He was raised in a religious community and later he was persecuted because he didn’t conform. He was all about love
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Renee Hendrix
There is absolutely nothing wrong or satanic about this mural. The people complaining are probably parents upset that their child's mural wasn't chosen.
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Michael Siebielec
I find it rather odd, but not unusual at this point of time in the USA, that there seems to be no representation of a white boy in the drawing. We as a society continue to push a female agenda in schools that relegate boys to only sports and as an impediment to girls' successes. Of course, no one seemed to notice this. Boys are falling behind across the nation, but no one seems to care.
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Keith
OMG! This is just a child being a child. Using their imagination. Why can’t people just see things as they are, and not put titles or labels on everything? If people have not broken a law or committed a punishable crime then leave them be. Our society use to be much simpler and everything was just fine. Then one day someone started making much a do about nothing. I guess their lives were so miserable and they had nothing to do so they wanted to make something out of nothing and get into everyone’s business. Let kids be kids, life is tough enough as it is.
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Donald Michael Woodward
Religion can lead to extremism and many in the U.S. are beginning to fail at knowing where faith ends and fanatacism begins.
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Arnold Eugene Karr
Back in my days as a house-church Jesus freak, our pastor always referred to Satan as "the Enemy." In that context I take the words of the prophet Walt Kelly literally: "We have met the Enemy and he is Us." We are Satan when we choose to accuse, condemn, and destroy.
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Douglas Stephen Saldivar
As far as I can tell EVIL (by whatever name you wish to call it) is alive in the world. The idea of an Anti Christ as a great deceiver is important. Many "Christians" and "Moslems" believe they are following god's laws as told to them by false preachers. But they have been deceived and are now creating divisions, judgments, and anarchy in the world. They refuse to believe the existential threats to our world. They refuse to follow the real teaching of our saints and saviors. They want to build a grim world where all people must believe as they do and those who don't must face human judgment and punishment. Those who truly understand, know that GOD wants us to love one another and leave the judgments to an eternal wisdom
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Ernesto Manuel Gomez
We, as followers of Jesus, should live as we are convinced of His love toward us, of His grace and forgiveness. If we live our lives before others as we ought, what can a poster do to sway anyone's opinion. Look at, see it for what it means to you,embrace it or reject it. If a poster can harm, how strong is our confidence in our faith?
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Elaine A. Bentley
I am a 70 yr old Heterosexual Catholic woman and, call me crazy, but when I looked at this picture, I saw a very talented artist. If she added her own twist on it, ok, I understand the school board didn't approve. But to rip it apart and to accuse her of all these wrong doings is ridiculous!
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Reverend David
I myself believe that we should all live our lives without demeaning or belittling others. Everyone has an opinion and has a right to express that opinion. I wish you would stop calling people Bible thumper as that is a derogatory term and insults anyone who reads the Bible. I was born Catholic and went to church every Sunday and every holiday because I had no choice. Due to that I grew to dispise the Catholic religion. If we could all just try to teach compassion, tolerance, love and acceptance to others maybe people would understand that we are not all alike but we all deserve to be treated with respect.
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Jowanna A. Peterson
No offensive material seen by me here. People can interpret anything they want to make something what it's not. I personally don't like the gay oriented colors but at this point who cares? It's a health awareness poster.
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Theresa Gull
What the actual #%*@?? I think this is a beautiful message of inclusion. People need to have their heads examined, constantly looking for the negative. And here we are breathing life into these ridiculous accusations.
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Geoffrey C. Olive
Has anyone ever considered the scientific evidence of the universe that everything consists of atoms? The simplest element is hydrogen which is a single proton referred to as positive, and a single electron referred to as negative which circles the proton in the same way as the Earth circles the Sun. Neither atomic component can exist independently although nuclear physicists have managed to split the atom with consequences that could eliminate human existence! Applying this proven logic, religions, particularly xtianity, seem to think that their god is good, and the devil is bad and must be eliminated! Neither can exist without the other! If you believe the religious nonsense peddling you are also by definition a selective science denier! Just accept that whenever there is a positive, there will ALWAYS be an equal and opposite negative. Neither will EVER eliminate the other! So, just assume the universe is all there is and it’s made of atoms, no god(s) or devil(s), creator (who or what made the creator?) or anything else! Become an atheist and enjoy a wonderful life! Remember there is no such thing as a “before life”, so why should anyone believe there is an “afterlife”?
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Geoffrey C. Olive
PS. Don’t forget Santa is an anagram of Satan!🤔🤪
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Christal L Merkey
I personally didn't see anything wrong with the picture. Just because some little girl was wearing rainbow colored leggings and there was a ghost on there doesn't make something satanic.
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Christal L Merkey
I personally didn't see anything wrong with the picture. Just because some little girl was wearing rainbow colored leggings and there was a ghost on there doesn't make something satanic.
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Jack Gerber
When I first saw the the picture of the mural and read about the objections of the Christians I was amazed. I couldn't figure out how anyone could find it offensive in any way. I am curious now, though. Do those of you who are devout Christians see the work of the Devil around you a lot?
At first I was laughing at it but then I realized that as a Wiccan, I see the work of the Goddess around me all the time as well so it appears that this is a natural part of being a human being.
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Daniel Joseph Morse
There are 435 obscenities elected to the legislative branch of FedGov. Fix that. Our foreign policy is an obscenity. Fix that. Some kid's bogus poster is not the concern. The brainless parents who breed are the concern. My point of view is that of a Combat Infantry veteran of VietNam. I like guns and don't like liberals. Things like this make me VERY glad I carefully didn't have children. I leave no hostages to idiocy when I die.
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Nicky
I see the items the school board is referring to as being demonic and or witchcraft related and a few other items that I find odd, in my opinion I see no reason for those items to be in this particular mural as for the (RAINBOW) symbol has been taken from a sweet add to a nursery or a care bear is now referred to as a (GAY) symbol now and I personally find it repugnant why couldn't the LBGTQ community create an original symbol or why couldn't ppl just see a rainbow as a rainbow...PERSONAL IM TIRED OF EVERYONE GETTING THERE PANTIES IN A TWIST ABOUT EVERY LIL THING OR BEING OFFENDED OVER THE MOST STUPIDEST THING.....WHAT I WOULDN'T GIVE TO BE A KID AGAIN LIFE WAS SWEET NOW IT LEAVES A VERY SOUR AFTER TASTE......SO OVER IT !!!!
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Arnold Eugene Karr
Why not create an original symbol? I'm not sure there can be any original symbols after tens of thousands of years of human artistic representation. We can only reinterpret and revalue what has gone before. "We stand on the shoulders of giants."
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AnnaMarie Ingrassia
people who find anything "demonic" here are just paranoid and projecting their own prejudices. It is a mural depicting that children and adults should stay healthy year around. It depicts the christian holidays and other symbols which represent other religions, like the HAMSA. THIS "Universal Life Church" supports Wikka...and Judaism, Islam, etc... as well as Christianity. Why are the Christians trying to make this child's art evil? PROJECTION !!!!!
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Robin Cohen
Ridiculous Christian pushers. I believe : freedom for all! This is a wonderful mural. I love everything about it. I see what was on the mind of the artist. Santa, Halloween, doctors, vaccines & peace. This was painted with an open heart and love. This artist is growing and learning to be well rounded and open to differences.
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Laurie Kinns
Unbelievable! Do these people have nothing better to do than pick apart a painting! People need to learn the meaning of the phrase ' it's not all about you!'
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Laurie Kinns
Unbelievable! Do these people have nothing better to do than pick apart a painting! People need to learn the meaning of the phrase ' it's not all about you!'
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Kathleen Miller
This is so ridiculous. A person cannot say anything because someone will be offended. Now a child apparently cannot express themselves through art. In my opinion there are people out there that just look for things to complain about. Everything put out there for the public will have some foolish and uneducated person complaining. We as a nation need to stop backing down because someone is offended. What happened to free speech ? We have to walk on eggshells for these people. I for one will continue to say and express myself as I always have and if someone complains about me or you or anyone for that matter, too bad. They can go live in a bubble.
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Douglas Granter
Why is no one addressing the real evil in this mural, HELLO KITTY! THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN!
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John Anthony Laben
What really annoys me is how the rainbow a sign from God has been corrupted by Satan to mean something else
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AnnaMarie Ingrassia
the rainbow has been corrupted by anti human humans...just like the swastika has been misappropriated by Nazis. Satan had nothing to do with it...It is all the doing of humans...
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Candace Sue Singleton
I agree. Humans are the worst creature on the planet, absolute worst. At this point in time there is no redemption either. We are slowly destroying the one world that we can live in. Humans will destroy themselves with their entitlement. And we ALL feel we have entitlement over the world in some degree or another.
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Amy Varela
A rainbow is made from light refracting off water droplets. There's evidence of that. There doesn't even have to be rain in order for there to be a rainbow. You can do it with a spray nozzle on a hose. Factual, scientific evidence proves it. Where is any proof that any of the gods created rainbows, and then where is the evidence that Satan corrupted it? In the biblical creation myth, Satan is the honest one. The character known as God is the liar.
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Troels Qvist
It sure is satan that Orchestrated this bad penmanship.. All hail SATAN. Norwegian black metal 🤣🤣🤣🤣
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Krystina S.
What a lovely mural. I don't understand how any ADULT could be so petty and cruel as to try to destroy the beautiful meaning behind the artist's Superhero themed Health Mural. As far as I know, the RAINBOW is a Jewish/Muslim/Christian symbol, A PROMISE FROM GOD "I WILL NEVER PUNISH MY PEOPLE AGAIN with cruel, planet-destroying flooding." Thus, the Rainbow imagery means NOT Judging. It also stands for many things in cultures throughout the world, as well as being the primary, vibrant colors children love and are drawn to. Rainbow CareBear and the Care Bear logo seen, is that gay? It was never gay for my children or grandchildren. As far as bicolored or striped clothing- well, ever since there were textiles, there were stripes and color blocks. I mean, really. Germs and diseases can be scary, and I think the smaller images show what whirl around our minds as we go to the doctor- fear, anxiety, hope, need, support. Why is everything always about something satanic to evangelical christians and some other kooks? They need help, not pandering to their belligerent, bullying, intimidating, demanding, cruelty.
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Daniel Gray
Oh for pitys sake! I have had a blue and white striped shirt like the child in the picture for over 45 years now....so now a striped shirt is a secret LBGT code? And as for the rainbow leggings, give me a break...Pippi Longstockings wore those in her books and that was way back in the late 60's, so I guess Pippi was a secret time traveling LBGT agent? Hows about these people just MYOB.
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Rev. B
Daniel, my old friend, you must know that I speak the truth when I tell you it physically pains me to say this but...I agree with you.
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Daniel Gray
Just goes to show you are actually coming to your senses and seeing things in a logical and crystal clear light not being shaded by morons and idiots.
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Rev. B
And just like that, you ruined it.
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Alun Lloyd Palmer
Nothing wrong with the mural. Those who complained want their beliefs to be the only ones allowed in a country that is supposed to have separation of church and state. Next they will be trying to get the Supreme Court to ditch that principle. I am an atheist ULC minister and I am English but live in the US. Back home we have an established religion, that which is called Episcopal in the US, but nobody would ever dream of making these kind of loopy complaints. Mind you, church attendance is about a third of what it is in the US.
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Daniel Gray
1st Alun we do not and never have had any thing like Separation of Church and State as the Constitution was ratified in 1787, and the very first mention of this myth was in 1802 from Jefferson to his Danburry Conn Baptist detractors. Now the ONLY way you can add or subtract something from the US Constitution is by a constitutional amendment which has never happened concering this myth of Separation of church and state. The Supreme Court of the US cant do it nor can anyone else. So there is no principal to ditch as it never existed in the first place. And how can you claim to be a minister for a religion (and yes atheism and humanism have been ruled to be religions by our Supreme Court) like atheism? Atheists dont believe in a Deity therefor they have no need of someone to "preach" to them about it or about something they claim does not exist. Maybe you need to choose your words more carefully.
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Arnold Eugene Karr
The 1st amendment rectified that oversight in the Constitution in 1791. Though the text of the amendment does not contain the words "separation of church and state," Jefferson's inference is quite defensible and, in my opinion, correct. It is also evident from the original text of the 1787 document that a purely secular government was intended. No mention is ever made of God or any specific religious belief or institution, and religious tests for public office are explicitly prohibited.
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Daniel Gray
Nope sorry they are not and never have been. Case in point the religious school that applied for and was denied rubber shavings for their playground. It went all the way to the SCOTUS and the SCOTUS ruled in a SEVEN TO TWO decision that this violated the 1st amendment. No say what you want but when you are wrong then you are wrong. And if you want anyone to believe your myths then post a links PROVING this is what happened. I wont hold my breath on this waiting.
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Candace Sue Singleton
So, you're a Boebert convert. If chris chens get their way and merge politics with religion, then anyone that is not chris chen will probably either get jailed, censored, exiled, murdered. You can't convince me that won't happen. Do we remember the Crusades? Do we remember the Burning Times? Over the centuries it has been chris chens that have committed the most atrocities against FELLOW human beings for simply not believing what they believed.
I've been watching society lately and I think there will be another Crusade/Burning Times. I'm truly concerned for my grand-children.
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Nathaniel Robert Hunt
Daniel Gray So my pagan church and all other non christian churches can be involved in politics then?
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Daniel Gray
sure can. as long as you are a recognized religion then yes you can be.
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Pastor George Day
Daniel Gray,
You are absolutely right!
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The Gray Minister
Wow.
I follow Christ My Lord God The Word I have been taught acceptance. If the church has man made laws then They should follow them.
But I look at the Red Words to see how to walk the middle path. All I see is acceptance.
Sure I dont agree with a lot but like I say. If it’s not affecting my life or hurting me or others. Then let them use the free will that The Father Created us with.
I’m sad to see this. So so sad.
Jesus helped people that weren’t Hebrew & taught them to do this. Jesus didn’t get kicked out of the bar Jesus didn’t throw The Devil in The Lake of Fire, he told him get behind me. As in I will even forgive you if you walk behind me. But no one seems to see this. All they see is what the person claiming to be following the middle path, instead of learning for them selves.
I could go on and on.
Even when I preach the truth of what The voice of my Lord Jesus my God The Word tells me and I’m told go away evil spirit. I smile & go because fighting with the blind, deaf & dumb.
So sad.
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Pastor George Day
The Gray Minister,
What you think you see simply isn't there, And if you still believe that Jesus, whois God, never sent Satan to hell, then read the book of Revelation.
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David Rodriguez
I am an artist and this mural is expressing every day life pros and cons nothing daemonic about this mural ..
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David Rodriguez
I’m an artist and this mural is expressing every day life pros and cons .. Nothing daemonic about this painting ..
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Simon E Blatta
Does this mean that Hobbits are real? I've ready several books that mention them. Cool.
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Stacey Owens
We live in a time when every self righteous person has to react when it doesn't pertain to them. Everything is a issue when it doesn't affect your life. I remember back in the day when people just kept moving forward, It was just news.
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Randall Worcester
Seems to me that these bible thumpers want people to believe they’re so righteous that they should control what everyone else sees. If you think a gay pride symbol is bad and should be removed, what would you say to the self proclaimed atheist who doesn’t like that fish on your car? Would you remove it and say “ I’m sorry I didn’t mean to offend you” Hell no you wouldn’t! If you’re “so” Christian you would know that Bible you have tells you “judge not lest ye be judged” and judgement is for God when you stand in front of him and explain yourself. Remember the Bible tells you YOU WILL BE JUDGED FOR WHAT YOU HAVE DONE, not what that person next to you did. I’m personally tired of Christians telling everyone they have to live their way. Myself, I’m Christian and I don’t give a hoot if someone is gay or straight.
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David Cox
What do you think Jesus would do?
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Olivier Ammour-Mayeur
Jesus was LOVE and COMPASSION, he was welcoming to anyone and he would embrasse the LGBTQ Communittee as a group of people asserting LOVE, COMPASSION and INCLUSIVITY!
That's what he would do!
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John D. Partin
Many people, such as yourself, put "love and compassion" over everything else and over truth, justice, order, and the will of God, but Jesus didn't even accept everyone in his time and tell people that there was nothing wrong with anything that they ever decided to do. He didn't accept the scribes and Pharisees just as they were and say that there "nothing wrong" with their being hard- hearted and only letter of the law people, but called them "whites sepulchres" and "a brood of vipers" and asked them "how shall you escape damnation?". He didn't accept the moneychangers in the temple just as they were and say that there was"nothing wrong" with their buying and selling in the temple precincts, but overturned their tables and drove them out with a scourge and told them "This is a house of prayer, but you have made it a den of thieves!". He didn't just accept the woman caught in adultery as she was, but told her, after he had dispersed her accusers, "Is there anyone here who has condemned you? Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more"------not "Go and go on sinning, the same as you always have". So, the actual Jesus Christ today doesn't tell LGBTQ or any other sinners "Go and go on sinning, the same as you always have" but, the same as he told that woman, "Go and sin no more" and doesn't accept just everything that they do. There is a false "love and compassion", as well as a genuine love and compassion. False "love and compassion" just go along with whatever people want to do and tell them that they are always "right" to do it, and tell them what they want to hear, instead of what they need to hear, in order to be popular with them. Genuine love and compassion tell people the truth and correct them when they are wrong, and don't worry if that makes them popular with those people, but only care that it helps them to avoid those dangers and come out of wrong thinking and actions. Falsely "loving and compassionate" teachers and people are "tickling men's ears with pleasing fables and lies", as Scripture warns us against. You can make up a "Jesus" to suit yourself and after your own image, so that he will fit into the current propaganda and political correctness, but that isn't the real Jesus, who still demands that we reform our lives and bring ourselves into submission to God's will and teachings, not bring God's will and teachings into submission to our thinking and will and political correctness and current propaganda.
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Michael Jerome Johnson
And there it is: strapping your hatred for our LGBTQ brothers and sisters to Jesus to justify your hatred.
To paraphrase the Bible, Jesus read your comments, and wept.
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John D. Partin
It just obviously isn't hatred for gay people, anymore than for straight people, to tell them that many things that they are doing are sins, but is telling them the truth and loving them --- loving them enough to warn them about dangers to their souls and spiritual lives, instead of hating them by telling that everything that they are doing is "okay and good".
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John D. Partin
Many people in here are always saying that the prohibition of homosexuality is "invalidated" because the same people who believe in and promote that teaching aren't following the Biblical laws against mixing fabrics or eating shellfish or other trivialities. Quite obviously, though, homosexuality is a much bigger and more pervasive issue than just some issues peculiar to ancient Jewish culture and so the prohibition of homosexuality is more relevant today than were those other prohibitions in the Bible. You might as well say that because people don't obey or get punished for violating the outmoded and ridiculous blue laws on the books across the country, they shouldn't have to follow or be punished for violating the laws against murder, rape, child molestation, bank robbery, and other major crimes. Likewise, our not following the outmoded laws in the Bible against eating shellfish, mixing fabrics, etc. isn't a valid reason for ignoring and not following the major teaching against homosexuality in the Bible.
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Pastor George Day
John D. Partin,
When you say 'homosexuality,' you need to differentiate between the condition (which is not chosen) and the objectively disordered acts (which are acts of the will). Having said that, being homosexual entails great suffering, and our approach to LGBT must be one of compassion and understanding.
Black statements like yours do a disservice to pastora outreaches like Courage International or True Freedom Trust.
You simply don't know enough to talk about this topic with authority.
Jesus said that some people are born eunuchs.
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Michael Jerome Johnson
Comment removed by user.
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J. Lenton
Jesus spent his life associating with the oppressed of his time - poor people, religious minorities, lepers, disabled people, people labelled as 'sinners' by the orthodox religions of the day, and so on (see, among others, Matthew 9:10-11 and Luke 15:1-2), and giving them compassion and solidarity and relief where he could - he healed the sick, fed the hungry, etc. etc., while sharing with them a message of peace and radical non-violence, calling on them to “resist not evil” (Matthew 5:39), love their enemies (Matthew 5:44-45), and go unprotestingly to martyrdom while publicly forgiving their executioners - a tenet he demonstrated through practice when he was crucified.
If Jesus were around today, he wouldn't be giving sermons in church telling people what 'sins' to hate, or complaining about the symbology of some mural or other. He'd be volunteering at a medical centre or helping out at a food bank or something - bringing not judgement or division, but love and support for those who need it most.
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John D. Partin
J. Kenton, Jesus didn't only care about people's physical needs, but also about their spiritual needs and the state of their souls, since otherwise there was no reason for him to preach the Sermon on the Mount, which was about ministering to people's spiritual needs and not just feeding the five thousand, and he would have used that time spent on preaching in feeding and healing people physically alone. People need to be fed and healed spiritually, too. That is the purpose of preaching against sins that we should hate and against any immoral symbology in painting where it actually exists and any immoral ideas and teachings in literature or political ideologies, such as Communism and Nazism. Otherwise, we could just ignore wrong and immoral thinking until it results in Holocausts and Communist purges and repressions and dictatorships and other crimes and injustices, instead of denouncing and teaching against them and trying to stop them before they get that far. Or we could not preach against any immorality in art and films until the envelope has been pushed of what people will let them get away with and just accept to the point of child pornography and other sick subjects, instead of trying to fight against this immorality before it gets to that point and keep fighting it after it does. Some people go too far in seeing evil everywhere, which is as bad as not seeing it where it does exist, and Satan uses both to make Christianity appear "repressive" to people or make it actually conforming to the world. Jesus didn't just accept the sins of the harlots and tax collectors and other sinners that he associated with because he was with them, since he said that he had come for the sinners, not the righteous (who wrongly believed that they didn't need to be ministered to), but told the sinners "Go and sin no more". He wasn't physically ministering to the scribes and Pharisees when he called them whites sepulchres, but was ministering to their souls, and he was ministering to the souls of the moneychangers in the temple and against their physical interests when he drove them out and overturned their tables and said "This is a house of prayer, but you have made it a den of thieves". So, yes, Jesus would be preaching sermons against sins if he were here physically in the world today and not just ministering to people's physical needs. This "Jesus" who would "only care about people's physical needs" is a false and unscriptural "Jesus", invented by people to have him not deal with their sins and not call anything sin, but only be a humanistic"Jesus" and only be "a good human teacher" and a social advocate and concerned with this world, instead of our eternity in Heaven or Hell.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Mr. Cox, Be careful you do not go that far into confusing anyone who does not believe exactly as you do to be God or Jesus haters. I do not think as you do but respect your right to your beliefs. I very much so believe in God, Mother and Father, and Jesus. I just do not believe the Bible is accurate in many places.
But you are correct that God loves and forgives His children. News flash... There will be no next coming or any such thing. Jesus never really left us. He and his teachings are always here for us. He lived out his human life with his family then returned Home.-
Lionheart
There is no evidence whatsoever to support what you’re saying, Lori-Ann. You are totally free, of course, to believe whatever you want. We only have here-say of anything he taught, and that’s if he ever really existed, which it’s possible he did, or at least someone like him may have existed.
We still have no demonstrable evidence that your god is real, or any of the worlds gods for that matter. 🤷🏼
🦁❤️
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Believe as you will. The teachings I follow do give me proof that I have no trouble taking on faith. But, given the mindset you seem to have, I doubt it would be enough for you. So I will just say have a good evening. And I did mean that. It wasn't sarcasm. lol
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Lionheart
I totally respect your comments, Lori-Ann. I do however only believe in demonstrable facts to support my beliefs. I have no reason to believe that Krishna, or Vishnu, or Thor, or even your God, are real.
Whatever the reasons you have for not believing that Krishna, or Vishnu, or Thor, et al, are not real gods, I have exactly the same reasons for not believing in your God, so you and I are very similar in that we don’t believe in many of the worlds gods, do we? It’s just that I believe in one less God than you do.
I am totally happy to believe in your God, if you can demonstrably prove your God is real. If all you are doing is relying on “faith”, which is no different to all the other worlds gods that other people believe in, then you are no different to them.
Thank you for your reply though 🤗
🦁❤️
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Pastor George Day
Lionheart,
The evidence is all around you. But the problem with your mindset is that, even if an angel from heaven appeared to you, you would probably deem it a hallucination!
Shalom!
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Lionheart
Please show me where there is demonstrable evidence for any of the world’s gods. There’s a Nobel prize waiting for your name to be engraved upon it if you can do so.
I’m sorry you think I have a problem with my mindset wanting demonstrable evidence to form my belief structure using logic, reason, and critical thought. Perhaps it’s just as well, otherwise I might be wanting to believe in Vishnu, Thor, or Wotan.
No one would believe me anyway if I saw an angel. Joseph Smith (of Book of Mormon fame) claims he saw an angel but I bet you don’t believe it, so why would anyone believe me? 🤭
🦁❤️
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Pastor George Day
Joseph Smith was a fraudster!
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Matthew Mastrogiovanni
Insanity. If it was religious, better Lucifer than God. God does plagues and floods. Lucifer does Heavy Metal and orgies.
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David Cox
Well when Jesus comes back and the Bible was true all along it will be to late for you. You can hang out with Satan all you want then but things will be totally different than you think. I feel sorry for you and my prayer is that God will have mercy on you. You have no idea what's in store for those who reject God's free salvation. Study for yourself
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
but you know that's not the case, right? when will you chris chens all learn that, while you are entitled to your beliefs you are NOT entitled to force others to believe or follow them. claiming nonsense from your b ible proves nothing. instead try just STFU and living like your je bus commanded you to. Huh...
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Lady Mutt Cat
I’ll take my chances. I’m sick of that nasty desert warrior god that you seem to think so highly of. I refuse to worship bullies.
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brian ham
Get a life !
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Tareq Asfour
Just like the other person give me a break also. Im sick and tired of America’s right wing neo nazi fundamentalist christians monstrous movement constantly trying to trying push a new age agenda that was used in 1940’s
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Alexander Arends
I guess you just can't please everybody. Other parents would be upset if there was a cross depicted somewhere.. We need to be civil, but stop trying not to offend anyone. Whoever drew this did a nice job in illustrating his/her own thoughts. It is a piece of art.
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Stacey Owens
It's not about pleasing anyone. It's not about them who are reacting. There is no need to respond. keep it to yourself. It doesn't affect the person who is responding. People don't need to know that your the god police.
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Alicia Szot
Seriously? It's about kids being superheros because they took the jab. Hmmm....maybe that's not too off the mark then.
But, really....this is NOT Satanic! Who thought up that one? I guess Christians like to see Satan in everything they don't fully understand. Get a grip, people!
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Colleen McAllister
I think it's fine. People are getting a bit too fussy over little things that don't mean anything.
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Nicholas J Page
Ok we know Jesus Christ died and was crucified and he has risen there has been scientific proof.But does Satan actually exist what proof do we have.Does hell exist again what proof do we have.We have none it's just that a myth.No real books no pictures apart from those made up.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
You may get as far as proof archeologically that he was crucified. But no proof of his death exist. He survived and lived a long happy life with his wife, Mary Magdalene, and his family. His mission was never to die for our sins. They are our own. But as long as you are not a dark entity, your place at home waits for you. We judge ourselves as to how well or not we lived out the charts we wrote for ourselves. before we reincarnated into this life. The bible was published by a corrupt church at the time. They picked and chose what to include. Then they edited that more for centuries. It is inaccurate. Replies that are nothing more than memorized verses from an inaccurate book do not help or add to the thread at all. If having one inspires you to be a better person, then it has done some good for you. But that is all.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Satan and hell do not exist. We are living as close to those concepts as we can be.
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
sorry charlie but there is NO SCIENTIFIC PROOF THAT JEBUS EVEN EXISTED, much less came back as a ZOMBIE). SATAN exists at least as much as your goD, probably more better gooder existings
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Dr. Darryl G Dykes
Satan does exist read Mathew chapter 4 starting with verse 1. Hell is mentioned in the bible at least 55 times.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Dr. Darryl G Dykes Not so fast. Try reading Ezekiel 23:20.
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Troels Qvist
You dont know..I guess we all will find out one day
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Arnold Eugene Karr
Or maybe we won't. Maybe Qoheleth was right: "The dead know nothing." (Ecclesiastes 9:5)
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Dr. Darryl G Dykes This is what's great about the Bible, it's full of contradictions. You say Hell in mentioned in the Bible 55 times. Other say 31, But most say the word "hell" does not appear a single time, not even once, in the Hebrew Bible, or Old Testament. And the word "hell" is not in the New Testament either. You can easily confirm this fact yourself, by using an online Bible search tool to scan various Bible translations for the word "hell.
So Dr. Darryl G Dykes how can you make it appear 55 times?
This is why young people don't want nothing to do with Christians and the Christian religion. People just make stuff up.
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Pastor George Day
Douglas Robert Spindler,
Hell, or Hades/Sheol, in Scripture, refers to the place of the dead. Until Jesus' resurrection, there was no distinction between hell (as we understand it today) and heaven, because people only shared the joy of the resurrection, which the Sadducees rejected.
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Colleen McAllister
he exists. I've met several of his children.
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Lionheart
Wow, so you’ve met both Nancy Pelosi, AND Kamala Harris? That’s quite amazing.
🦁❤️
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John D. Partin
If Colleen McAllister had met Trumpelstiltskin, that would have been meeting more the child of Satan or actually Satan himself than any two or twenty or two hundred or two thousand Democrats that you or any other brainwashed Trumpophiles could come up with, except in your own hypnotized and slavish view!!
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Arnold Eugene Karr
History is not a science in the same sense as physics and chemistry, so there is no scientific evidence for any claims about Jesus or anyone else from the ancient world. Historians attempt to arrive at a consensus about what most probably occurred in the past. Most will agree that Jesus existed, that he was an apocalyptic preacher and that hi was crucified on orders from Pontius Pilate (who is probably no more or less likely to have existed than Jesus). The resurrection is a statement of faith and not an historically verifiable fact.
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Parson Golden
Well, seeing any evidence of “Satanism” in that mural is pretty much related to humankind, which invented the cellar dweller to begin with.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
I hate to be the bearer of bad news to jj, but Satan doesn't exist. That concept was created by the church to control people. As to the artwork, It sound like a school that says it doesn't tolerate bullying is guilty of it themselves. they bullied the artist into changing perfectly fine work to cater to scared little bigoted fanatics.
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Dr. Darryl G Dykes
Loi-Ann Neeb, Lucifer aka Satan aka The Devil aka the tempter aka El Diablo does exist Read Mathew chapter 4 starting at verse 1. Then let us know
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Believe as you will. That is your right. But I stand by mine. If you have seen my reply you know I am gnostic Christian and acknowledge that the bible is inaccurate. It was published by a corrupt church with its own agenda. I disregard anything that starts "the bible says..." or claims that as any kind of verification alone. If you wish to prove anything to me, I would listen and respectfully at that. But if your Bible is all you have, you come to the table empty handed.
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Pastor George Day
There's no such thing as a gnostic Christian, ori. The two just don't go together.
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Lionheart
I guess it looks like you’re one if those that loves to quote from a book, written by very dubious authors, that never met the people they are talking about, and no demonstrable evidence to back up their claims. Until then, all those stories and tales have to be taken with a pinch of salt, but you are of course free to believe anything you read.
Spoiler alert, the Harry Potter books are also fictional stories, just in case you’re wondering, Darryl.
🦁❤️
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Pastor George Day
Lionheart,
The Bible is breathed of God. Harry Potter is breathed of Satan!
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Lionheart
In reality, you really don’t know that to be a true statement. You believe it to be true due to your indoctrination, but there is no real demonstrable evidence to support your claim.
Secondly, Satan is a human construct, much like your god is. Neither of them have any demonstrable evidence of their reality to support your claim. Sooooo, until there is this type of evidence they fall into the same category of fiction as the Harry Potter books.
I look forward to your comments on this blog for the years 2023 and 2024.
🦁❤️
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Pastor George Day
Lionheart,
Are you familiar with Kumran?
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Lionheart
Yes I’m familiar with Qumran and the Dead Sea Scrolls.
🦁❤️
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Pastor George Day
Then you know there's no comparison with Harry Potter. The devil is a liar!
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
thank you for praising SATAN
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Rev. B
"Read Mathew chapter 4 starting at verse 1. Then let us know"
Okay, so you've convinced me he is a storybook character. Now what?
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Lori-Ann Neeb
I hate to be the bearer of bad news to jj, but Satan doesn't exist. That concept was created by the church to control people. As to the artwork, It sound like a school that says it doesn't tolerate bullying is guilty of it themselves. they bullied the artist into changing perfectly fine work to cater to scared little bigoted fanatics.
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Arnold Eugene Karr
Actually,.the character Satan is older than Christianity. In the book of Job, Satan (the Accuser) is a member of the heavenly court who searches out evil or imperfection in humans and reports them to YHWH. The elevation of Satan to semi-divine status may have come from Zoroastrianism, a Persian faith, which teaches there are two gods representing an ongoing conflict between good and evil. If we are going to create gods for ourselves, I think that's a more honest representation of how the world works.
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Doc Michael Pepper
Ah, refreshing. Someone who has actually studied the Bible a bit (and can even refer to the heavenly court. That is what bothers me most. Those who are so so adamant about how they think the Bible reads and what's in it whether that is how it's actually written or not.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
There in lies an issue that unfortunately clouds people's minds. The book can be interpreted and used differently by just about every reader. Only a minor issue most of the time but cult leaders almost always know the bible inside and out. They then pick and choose what to use to promote whatever their cult dictates to followers. On this thread alone a few responders have used their own interpretations to justify anti-God beliefs.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
I didn't know that. Thank you.
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
Satan exists if chris chen's goD exists. I can live without Satan but only if the chris chens are willing to live without their goD
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Believe it or not, that statement has a left handed kind of truth to it. Satan does not exist. Your belief may be real and you are entitled to it. We all must find the path that speaks to us. As long as others respect my right to my beliefs, I respect theirs. It is also true that the vengeful and spiteful, jealous God of the old testament has never been a true representation. That was all the work of the church to control the people. God has never wanted his children to fear him. He loves all his children the same. Even you. Fundamentals and conservatives often give the concept of "Christian" a bad rep these days. I am a gnostic Christian but anyone of any faith who follows Jesus real teachings, not accurately portrayed in the Bible, know the real meaning of Christian.
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George Pitagorsky
Belief without open minded and open hearted inquiry is ignorance. Look into your heart and question even your most dearly held beliefs to find the truth. Where's the love?
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Rev. B
Belief without open minded and open-hearted inquiry is what the xtians call "faith".
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Pastor George Day
Rev. Dr. Father JJ,
Your sarcasm is just pathetic and makes no one laugh!
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David Cox
I can't believe that so many people hate God that much to talk bad about him like this blog always does. You criticize people and judge people. All of yall are Jesus haters. One day he is coming back for his true church those who truly belive. Not everyone who calls themselves Christian are Christian. Those who don't believe that Jesus died for their sins will be judged by God's law. Turn away from your sins and Jesus will forgive you
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
why do so many people hate Satan? ever think that you got it all wrong and backwards and that Satan is the true path and that your goD and jebus are the path to hell? and stop quoting from your book, it's written by men who looked to control other men. Lucky for you my Satan is neither psychotic nor vengeful and does not care if you believe in him or not. nothing will happen to you if you don't. See...isn't that more pleasant than your beachy, moody, sullen goD?
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Candace Sue Singleton
The chris chen G'd is a jealous one. He used fear to coerce people into believing in him OR ELSE.
Why give us free will and not let us exercise it? The chris chen G'd has set humanity up to fail. Perfection cannot be achieved because there is no such thing as perfection.
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Joe R Day
That's why they tell us "You will sin, because you're imperfect. You must REPENT and then you will be Forgiven!" The only way into heaven is belief in Jesus and repenting your sins... Afterwards, you can return to sinning with a clean slate... lol I think that is wrong, but none listen when I speak. So, I live my life with compassion and love. I try to not judge (it's not hard), I treat everyone like I wish they would treat me and I don't discuss politics or religion. It works pretty well and my life is calm and thankful.
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Justin Long
Ave Satanas. Ave te ipsum. Well said.
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John D. Partin
Why do so many people hate Satan? Because of what those who are following him and friends with him (and not just the public relations version of that) show us that he is actually like. Satan's actual followers and friends don't care about what people think about them and what they do or about their image and public relations, and those actual followers and friends of Satan are the murderers, serial killers, rapists, child molesters, genocidal dictators (such as Hitler and Stalin), domestic abusers, and others committing real evil in the world. Those other people claiming to be Satanists while not committing these actual evils are just public relations agents and trying to sell Satanism to the world and make it more acceptable to people. That isn't scapegoating Satan for all of the evil in the world, but just identifying him with what his own followers and friends say that he leads them into doing and what they say that he is all about. You can't have it both ways and Satan is leading people into all of these rotten things, but, somehow, he is better than all of these people!! That won't fly!! Satan can't be non-psychotic and non-vengeful when he is leading people into and inspiring them into committing psychotic and vengeful actions because their leader and inspirer isn't going to be better or nicer than they are. Satan isn't going to reward his followers and friends with a big party in Hell after they die because no people who hate other people even in this world throw parties for them (except a necktie party to hang them or a pig party to insult and ridicule and mock them or a party such as was thrown for Rasputin to kill him), and Satan hates all people far more than any human being could ever hate them, as he proves by all of these things that he inspires people to do. Satan has something far more rotten in mind for those who go down to Hell than any big party for eternity!! If you were trying to lure someone into a trap, you wouldn't come right out and show it for what it really is, but would disguise it and make it look as appealing as you possibly could because that is the only way that you will succeed in trapping and catching them. That is how drug dealers get people hooked on drugs and pimps get women into prostitution or cult leaders lure people into their cults or all other promoters of evil in any area lure people into their traps by making them seem "harmless". And Satan is far smarter than any human being and so what we can figure out to trap and lure people, he can figure out even better. "For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is not strange if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds" (2 Corinthians 11:13-15). God hasn't set up humanity to fail and gave us free will, but there are consequences to our choices that we bring upon ourselves, including Hell. God has never sent anyone to Hell, but anyone who has ever gone to Hell put himself or herself there, the same as criminals put themselves in jail or prison by their own actions and decisions to commit crimes. The door to Hell is locked on the inside, as C.S. Lewis wrote. How many people do we know even in this world who exist in self-made and self-sustained Hells when the way out of them is clearly right in front of them, and still they stay stuck in their Hells of drug addiction and other problems. If people can even get stuck in Hells right in this life, how much easier must it be for some of those in the afterlife to get stuck in a Hell of their own making by becoming more and more entrenched over millions of years in their rotten thinking and rejection of God, and harder for them to come out of all that?!!
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Rev. Rory
Yikes.
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Johnnie Roberte Lambert
David Cox: Not everyone on this blog is chris chen. You show your intolerance by assuming that your religion is the only way. You have a right to believe what you believe and I have a right to my beliefs. I don't need forgiveness from your G'd.
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Nathaniel Robert Hunt
David Cox Me (and all others) existing and living our lives as we see fit, worshiping Gods of our own choosing or no God don't mean we hate the biblical god, we have the protected right to live our own life without others telling us what to do, or trying to force their religious laws onto us.
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Pastor George Day
Nathaniel Robert Hunt,
This isn't a blog, though it takes that form. We are a church monastery. ULC is a denomination of Radical Protestantism (aka Universalism).
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Amber Fry
Then shouldn't those judgements be made by God and not by other people? Everyone has very different ideas of what living as a Christian is all about these days so who is right? Who is wrong? Why bother trying to work that out when the whole idea is about minding your own way of life in your own Godly/Christianly way. Dictating it to everyone else, demanding of everyone else came out of fear, not love. God judges how you behave, not how you think others should behave. Anyone who claims to be Christian really needs to take more time studying what Jesus actually said and did. He was the one who said people could do what he did, be like he was. Study him more. Be like him more.
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Rev. MichaelRS
It's supposed to be a mural about kids staying healthy. Why does there have to be a nod to sexuality or religion, one way or the other, in it at all?
Or, if you have to have them, why not "include" all the other symbols, such as ULC has at the bottom of this blog post, and a kid wearing a Straight Pride patch or piece of clothing?
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Lori-Ann Neeb
reading the entire story, it seems to me the school board bullied the artist into changing his work which had nothing wrong with it anyway .
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Cyril R. VanKeirsbelk
Their wall, their choice.
They asked the artist to remove some unimportant parts of the artwork and left all the important ones in. The artist agreed to do so, it's a non-problem.
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
So what's wrong with satan? He gets a bad rep because someone had to be the fall guy for the psychotic, masochistic, misogynistic, homophobic, child-killing, narcissistic, insecure chris chen goad. Ave Satana, let the left hand path guide you
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Tamara Oelkers
Right On, Reverend.
Satan never delivered a single plague or flood that I'm aware of.
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Tareq Asfour
Who told you Satan/Lucifer was all that it was never all that is this what this Christianity has taught you G’D gave mankind free will. He sent down many angels and sent down many manuals of what is good and what is evil and what to do and what not to do and in the end whenever it comes Lucifer/ Satan as you know well deal with mankind‘s poor decisions so please don’t refer to Lucifer in that manner if you don’t know about him/her please
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
So what you're saying is you are entitled to your belief but I am not entitled to mine? that's not very chris chen of you (or on second thought, maybe it's exactly chris chen of you).
Anyway you can believe as you wish but you have no right to tell me my beliefs are wrong. Different, sure, not to your liking, okay, but not, no, never wrong.
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Amber Fry
Not at all the point. The point is not to project your belief onto everyone else. You do you. Live your life the way you feel is right and allow space for everyone else to do the same. No judgment, no condemnation, just do you and give people space to do the same.
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Dr. Darryl G Dykes
No one person or entity can make a person do anything, It is the choice of the doer to do so. Fact I personally take responsibility for what I do. I do not blame anyone or entity for my actions. I pray for guidance and Grace while also seek forgiveness for my sin. I know I am not perfect, I try to live a life that pleases God.
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Pastor Jim
It looks like an LGBTQ mural to me.
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Simon E Blatta
When I view it, I see beauty, warmth, talent. Depends on the lenses one wears. Through lenses of love, beauty is reflected. Through lenses of hate or fear, beauty is obscured.
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Olivier Ammour-Mayeur
Ever wondered why it is so problematic to you that you have to "exorcise" everything you consider LGBTQ??
For me that is the real question! Not the mural.
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Pastor Jim
Nope. Good luck with that (finding the answer too your question).
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Richard Darwin Richards
It definitely follows the "woke" guidelines and therefore should be considered immoral.
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Rev. Dr. Father JJ
"woke" = dog whistle for chris chen nationalist who want to make AMERICA a chris chen nation and rule it according to sharia law. NEVER I say, NEVER will that happen. let's let SATAN rule as he is far more peaceful and calm and fair than the chrs chen, jew ish or mus lim goDs. AVE SATANA!
fun fact, if you actually read (even silently) the name of satan, you have let him into your heart and brain. welcome to club SATAN
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Pastor George Day
Rev. Dr. Father JJ,
I would NOT want to be in your shoes.
One day you'll regret this very highly. But it will be too late.
Eternity with Satan is a long time!
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Olivier Ammour-Mayeur
Right, so men cheating on their wives, like "taking women by the pussy", but pretending to be good Christian; stealling money by forging their income to not pay taxes; exploting people by telling fake news twice a day just to make more money; killing people (because it's their right!) are not immoral??
But a nice none discriminatory painting is?
Then, I guess you probably need to go to therapy to sort things out about what really matters in life.
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Richard Darwin Richards
We do not support Biden so your diatribe does not pertain to us
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Rev. Dr. G. Waldron
Give me a break! Why do so many people always have to find bad? Just looking for something wrong is a brain problem, I think.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
Christians do it all the time with the Bible. They can twist a quote in the Bible into anything they want.
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Susan Laschiazza Russell
Non-Christians do it all the time too. Human nature turns every minute of every day into personal reality. We are all in the same storm, not the same boat.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Susan Laschiazza Russell Why is is Christians do it more and are louder about it?
Christians are in one heck of a wicked storm of their own creation and belief. Non-Christians just go about enjoying life. Only storms they encounter are the ones created by the Christians.
Hope you know today's young people are looking at what the Christians are doing to society and our country and cringe. They want nothing to do with the Christian religion and Christianity and have a wonderful life without the storm.
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Susan Laschiazza Russell
Non-Christians do it just as much as Christians. Human nature morphs actual reality into personal reality every minute of every day to benefit (or shame, upset, depress, etc. depending on your mental health status) the individual's needs.
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Stefano Di Stefano
Yes
I see ugly and pro lgbtq+ not that there is anything wrong with that. Again who cares. SATAN approves this message