Seth Owen was a high school sophomore when his Southern Baptist parents uncovered a secret he'd been keeping for years. He was gay.
"I was writing a paper, and my dad decided to check my phone late in the evening," recalled the now 18-year-old Owen. "He found a damning photograph of me and another guy. Nothing inappropriate, but it clearly indicated that I was gay."
His parents were shocked, and began grilling him on his sexuality an ordeal which lasted late into the morning hours. Unsure how to proceed, they eventually decided a healthy dose of Christian counseling would be the best way to set him straight. "It was not like a conversion camp, but it was definitely awkward conversion therapy where they tried encouraging stereotypical masculine tasks and things like that," Owen explained.
Conversion Therapy Lives On
Conversion therapy aims to change a person's sexual orientation or gender identity, although the strategy has been highly criticized and seems to be losing public support. Nonetheless, the numbers don't lie. Over 700,000 LGBTQ Americans between the ages of 18 and 59 have been subjected to conversion therapy at some point in their lives, a 2018 report from UCLA's Williams Institute found. Tens of thousands more will undergo conversion therapy before they turn 18.
After a few months spent undergoing highly questionable "conversion" tactics, Owen was finally able to convince his parents that no amount of therapy would turn him straight. He was gay, and that was that. But Owen soon found it impossible to reconcile his own beliefs with those preached at his parents' church: that gays should never serve in the church, and that transgender people were not human. When he pleaded for them to find a more inclusive parish, there was an ultimatum: accept our church or move out.
Things Reach a Breaking Point
In February of this year, as tensions between him and his family continued to escalate, Owen decided to leave home for the good of everyone involved. "The worst part was I was packing my bags, and I was walking out the door, and I was hoping that my mom would stand in my way," he explained. "I was hoping that she would say 'I love my child more than I love my religion.'"
It didn't happen.
Instead, another blow came soon after. While living with a friend, Owen learned he had been accepted to Georgetown University. But there was a problem tuition was far too expensive for him to cover, and his parents refused to help after he moved out. "I started to cry, because I realized there was no way that I could go to college," Owen said.
But just when all seemed lost, the community rallied around him.
**With a Little Help From His Friends
**
Owen's former biology teacher was moved by his story and decided to set up a GoFundMe page for his tuition. The initial goal was $20,000. As of today, the campaign has raised over $140,000 blowing the original goal out of the water. Owen will now join Georgetown University's Class of 2022, and hopes his story will inspire others to embrace the adversity they're facing.
"I remember growing up and saying I had really strict religious parents, and people would brush it off," he said. "I would tell that sophomore kid to hold their head high, roll their shoulders back and be exactly who they are."
80 comments
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John Eftimiades
No matter what the outcome, it is still traumatic to be rejected by your parents. It reminds me a little of what the Amish do to their kids. When they hit 18 they tell them to go out and mingle with the world. When they come back they can decide to either commit to Amish life or not. The problem is if they choose to live out "among the English" they are chastised and removed from the family. In short, live by our rules or you no exist in our minds. Nice choice, and with little more than an 8th grade education it's no wonder so many stay on and live out their lives as Amish people.
I hope in time that Owen will come to see and accept what remarkably ignorant and selfish people his parents are. His challenge will be to love them for who they are and forge his own path. I am certainly pulling for him and anyone else who faces this terrible dilemma.
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Dave
John, I agree with your posting, but do have a question about the penultimate sentence. Why must he love them? They are not necessary to his life any more. It is their choice not to love him, so why should he waste his love on someone who caused him such pain and terror? I speak from experience that you don't need to love your parents if they were hurtful and hateful to you. No need to hate them either, just be indifferent. That is the opposite of love.
I would be interested in your opinion, as you are clearly articulate and thoughtful.
JMO, YMMV
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flugo
DaveJ: 'Why must he love them?' Because it's the right thing to do; it's the mature, strong thing to do; it's the ONLY proper thing to do.
Lack of love and indifference are the easy, woosie, coward's way to handle hurtful issues. It takes 'balls' to do what's not expected, what's contrary to human nature. . . . .. to 'walk the extra mile'.
God's Word says we are to love the unlovable; our enemies. If we demonstrate no love and forgiveness, we cannot expect God's forgiveness of our sins.
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Dave
I'm again curious. Without resorting to exhortations from a [bronze age book designed to subjugate people, vindictive and childish god], why do you say it's the right thing to do? Is it necessary to love them? I have forgiven my parents, they only did what they could do based on who they were, but why waste love on someone who could never love back? Are you in favor of people staying in hurtful marriages as well? "Whom god has joined together..." What about bad bosses? Should you be like Joseph and just stay there? Wow.
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flugo
It's good to have an'anchor' in life. And, mine is the eternal, inerrant Word of God.
In the book of Romans, we find ALL authority is from God. Good, bad or indifferent . . . . . . to carry out His eternal purposes. And we are to respect these authority figures. If we don't like the 'supervisor', move on. We are NOT to resist/badmouth the authority, for it of God Who ordained it..
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Carl Elfstrom
I speak from experience: two wrongs don't make a right. Also, people change. Change is inevitable. Just because his parents don't accept him now doesn't mean they never will. Then again, they might not, but who's to say. And how important is coming out and being known that we have to shout it from rooftops, and flaunt our stuff in front of everyone, including those who we know won't accept us. What's wrong with living a discreet, humble, quiet life of kindness and altruism ? Perhaps that would be too spiritual, for some ministers.
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Dave
Coming out is not necessarily "flaunting our stuff in front of everyone" just as being heterosexual doesn't mean dressing provocatively or hairy chested with gold chains. Sure, some people do that, but it's not the norm. I also don't think it's necessary to flaunt your religion, although most evangelical christians think it is. (Yes, the lack of capitalization is purposeful. Most christians would condemn Christ for being non-European, rather socialistic, and forgiving of prostitution, etc.) Why do most conservatives (and I was raised conservative Baptist) condemn people who don't follow in their lockstep?
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flugo
DaveJ: Most conservatives DO NOT condemn PEOPLE. They condemn the behavior and attitudes of people. This is what Christ did and encouraged us to do as well.
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Carl Elfstrom
Seth is apparently doing a good job of shouting it from rooftops right now,Dave, or we wouldn't be talking about him. And thanks for letting us know that you're turned on by hairy chested straight men who wear gold chains. Did you know that a lot of gay men have hairy chests too, and many of them are more butch than most straight men? Besides that, straight men can never fall in love with you. So are you only into superficial relationships, like tea-room tricks, sister.
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Carl Elfstrom
I don't believe that anyone who loves someone can make a conscious decision to quit, and do so. That is not true love, or what love is about. Love is many things, and not easy to define, although it is easier to say what it is not. It is not shallow, but deep, and can't be felt, given, or discarded whenever we choose. Love is steadfast and endearing, but we sometimes become confused and don't always realize it when we love someone, like when hurt feelings get in our way, and we must only love at a distance, but even then love remains. I don't think I've ever stopped loving that which I have truly started loving, even though I have sometimes been confused about how I should love that which has failed to remain the same. Still, love remains.
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Beth K
I agree with you, DaveJ. If your parents are hurtful people - physically or emotionally or financially - as a child OR as an adult, you don't have to continue to love them. A young child needs someone to care for him.or her, and express love - and at the same time does not deserve abuse or harm. Yet, some parents do it. The legal system will remove such children and/or imprison the parents. Certainly, no one would say that such a child should love his/her parents under those conditions. There's more to earning the love for a child than giving birth or giving a sperm cell.
Yes, indifference is the answer to that. Live well. Give your love to someone who has earned it, or who needs it, and don't waste it on someone who has rejected it or you, or used your love or even sense of duty to abuse you further. I too speak from experience. Yes, I have been criticized, but there are others who need something I can give them who don't misuse or abuse me or anyone else.
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flugo
Wow, BethKC! You must not be reading God's Word!
Unloving, indifferent, earning love. . . . . what a miserable response. Real love transcends the wrongs others do to you. Love operates regardless of your circumstances.
Easy? No! But, with God's (the supreme Lover) help we can do unto others what we would want others do to us. Love and forgiveness go hand in hand. And, we cannot expect our righteous, loving Heavenly Fathers to forgive us when we don't forgive others.-
SuzyQ
No you do NOT have to love and forgive those who have been vile to you!!! It is a choice, and one I exercise. Since the Bible and God of the Bible mean ZERO to me, I am FREE!!! I am NOT gay. I am a straight, 56 year old female, who has seen the indignities that Christianity heaps upon those who do not "submit". Not concerned with whether or not an invisible God forgives me, so when I forgive or do NOT forgive someone, the responsibility is all mine, for better or for worse. Scary, isn't it?? To be responsible for ourselves, and not pin whatever you do or do not do, on some unseen being....Also, very liberating!!! And as I read some of Bob's comments, this is the perfect example. Yep, you are "really" showing Christian love and acceptance....Calling people spineless and cowardly, because they struggle to forgive their abusers??!! The epitome of a Christian right THERE!! And BethKC....RIGHT ON!!!
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Lori
SuzyW... you hit that right on the head. These self-righteous folk that throw the bible verses around really don't get that they're not bringing people into the fold. They're driving them away. If they truly walked the walk they wouldn't use the bible as a weapon. They would use it to better themselves so they can present God in a more positive way. It's funny how blind and disconnected people become when they become obsessed with what verses says what. They pick and choose the verses that suit their needs. But I always forgive them, for they know not what they do.
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Crystal
BethKC, very well said. I recently divorced an emotionally and verbally abusive alcoholic man after being married to him for 28 years. We have two daughters, age 19 and 14 who now have nothing to do with him. Watching my younger daughter now go through PTSD and anxiety after the years of living with him is very difficult. Many family friends have told the girls they need to be "nice" to their dad or spend time with him. But, honestly, they are wrong. Nobody should be forced to spend time with their abuser. It is a sad situation for him, but we gave him so many opportunities to get help. Nobody should ever be pressured into spending time with their abuser, whether the abuse was psychological, emotional, verbal or physical. Ever.
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Carl Elfstrom
It doesn't sound like his parents were being very abusive to me. I'm sorry that so many of our fellow ministers have suffered from abusive relationships, as have I, but seeing our own abuse through this man is only turning a mole hill into a mountain. His parents never had to deal with such an issue before, and turned to the only source they knew of for help, their religion. I'm not a christian either, but Wiccan, which doesn't make me any less spiritual or religious. I don't agree with the way his parents handled the situation, but that doesn't make them axe murderers. [ By the end of the comments on this article I wouldn't be surprised if they seemed like such.] It is often good for young adults to move away from home, and try living on their own, but that's no reason to end all family ties. I started living on my own when I was seventeen (in 1980), and was glad to get away from my abusive stepfather, and verbally abusive grandmother, but didn't quit loving her. Whenever I went home for visits I left whenever they started getting offensive. I feel bad for those of you who aren't from close-knit families, and can't understand what it means to have close family ties, bonds and commitments to loved ones, despite not always agreeing with the way they have treated us. It makes y'all sound like very immature crybabies, who pout whenever you can't get your way.
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SuzyQ
Carl Elfstrom....That is of course YOUR opinion, just like everyone else, including myself, has one. I did NOT have abusive parents, and like you, not a Christian. Where we differ, is that I feel everyone has a choice in HOW they feel and deal with things....His parents chose to take the stance of disowning their own child. HE chose to say, "OK, fine....done we them, as well", in response, which he had every right to do! I will never understand, no matter what "religion" you adhere to, HOW IN THE HELL, could loving parents, disown their child for sexuality! Where is the love, man??? And calling people crybabies, spineless and cowardly (Those two came from elsewhere, obviously.) is not the "Wiccan Way", from what I've been told, either, brother!
So....BLESSED BE!!! ;-) Pagan HERE ;-)
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John Eftimiades
It is certainly difficult to love people who have hurt you either emotionally or physically. When I worked as a houseparent for emotionally disturbed boys I was always amazed at the kids willingness to visit their parents and the environment with which they were removed from. These kids would always come back from the visit angry and destructive from the experience because nothing would have changed. They would leave with hope and come back with despair. They could not yet see that their parents were drug addicts or like them, had been abused in their childhood. It takes a long time for a person to accept who their parents are as people. Many people are never able to remove themselves from being someone's son or daughter and see their parents as individuals; individuals who came to parenting with a generous supply of baggage and dirty laundry.
I am not some kind of flower child, you know Love for Everyone. But I have seen adults who were abused as children leading happy, productive lives. Those that pull it off have a commonality. A certain measure of both forgiveness and love. I know it's cliched, but that can only come when one walks in another one's shoes. Only when you can learn at some level to forgive and love can you move on and grow.
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Lori
Nice, John. I like and respect what you said.
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Carl Elfstrom
Suzy W, I think that nineteen eighties song by his holiness Adam Ant applies best to you at this time. You know, the one that goes "Goody-two, G)goody-two, goody, goody two shoes!"
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Carl Elfstrom
And SuzyW.Creamcheese,Thankyou Mother Goddess for explaining to me what's not the Wiccan way, but this natural, eclectic, solitary who you may also know as Raven Apollo, was initiated into the old religion on January1,1980, by the Goddess (who is the only one that initiates), following my year and a day of training by my mentor, who was a natural hereditary Witch and a gypsy (and is now one of my spirit guides). I think it is you who are misinterpreting the Wiccan way, my dear. Blessed be your feet that have carried you here, and all the way up. I'm sure you know the rest, if you are truly that which you claim to be.
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Lori
Oooooo....let the witch wars begin! This could get more nasty than the bible verse throwing. Blessed be!
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Dave
John, good thoughts and well explained. The only disagreement I have is the last sentence. Forgiving is necessary, loving, imnsho, is not. Carrying a grudge (lack of forgiveness) is holding your breath until the other person passes out. Not useful. But not loving those who have hurt you is more like finding other people who need a meal, and sharing your bounty with them instead of those who clearly don't want your love.
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Carl Elfstrom
Or, could Suzy W be another neo-pagan who read a book on the subject, and now thinks she's the goddess incarnate, which might just mean another crybaby.
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flugo
DaveJ: God's way is to love! Being indifferent or hating is the easy, the spineless, the cowardly way to treat the hurtful. It takes 'balls', courage and forgiveness to 'right the wrong'. And, we are foolish to think we deserve forgiveness from God when we don't love and forgive others.
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Dave
Sorry, Bob, you only get one vitriolic attack per topic. :-)
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Lori
Yeah, Dave. Man up! This Godly person, bob, just called you easy, spineless and cowardly. Get some 'balls'! It's obvious he's got quite a pair.
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Jason
So happy for him!
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REV. THEO KLEBES Interfaith Chaplin
Good for him and many blessings. Keep the faith!
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Carl Elfstrom
I come from a very large extended family. It's not uncommon for some of us to have problems with each other, but we are still family. I'm talking about my mother's side, Pistone and Maniscalco are the root families. Of course, they are Italian Catholics, and are much more close knit than my father's side named Elfstrom and Grave, and are Lutheran and Catholic, and originally of a higher social class, in England and Sweden. Needless to say I'm best known on my mother's side, and even know some of my fifth cousins. Some of my relatives are openly gay, but are not shunned by any of us. Some of our relatives have distanced themselves from the rest of us, for unknown reasons, but will be welcomed back if they ever care to include us in their lives again. However, for most of us it would be unimaginable to leave the family. And for the sake of unity and cohesiveness there may be some things about us that not everyone needs to know. It's sometimes better, for the good of the whole, to keep our mouths closed. The things we say don't only affect us individually, but affect our associates and loved ones as well. Why be so selfish as to hurt the ones who love us and call us family, to seek the acceptance of strangers and society, to forge a new path for ourselves, alone in this world, when we have family and loved ones hoping we will come home and join them. To do otherwise seems self-defeating.
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Frank Villari
Parents need to embrace the tenets of forgiveness, understanding, tolerance, and "sweet reasonableness" of Christ; basically, the love of Christ. Stop listening to organized religion, and start listening to the love of God.
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Maraya Perez-Sonntag
I am happy that such a loving human being can stand firm and find strength in adversity. As for his parents? LET THEM GO! If one is truly a believer in Compassion, Forgiveness, Love and Understanding, one cannot in Good Conscience despise their child. It seems that the parents are more concern about their image and position in their "church", than they are in the psychological, emotional and physical welfare of their son. Again I say, LET THEM GO! As long as one is the Child Of The Universal Parent, there are no bastards.
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Troy Hostetler
Your advice is correct, yet so very difficult.
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Lori
Nicely said. Let them go, but if they come back around somewhere down the line let them back into your life. Sometimes people do learn and grow and can gain a new level of insight.
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Gary Minnis
Obviously his parents never read this. 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8 Love never fails.
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Carl Elfstrom
And if we were all perfect people we would always do everything perfectly.
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Bro. James the Apostate, OSHSF
Glory!!! I was abandoned and shunned by my Baptist minister father/family and entire faith community in 1976 ... it was the best thing that ever happened to me!
Although it's been challenging, and Complex PTSD is not fun, there is hope for all of us.
Today, my God is so much bigger and Loving.
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CW
Why do people still think it is ok to hold religious beliefs that have been proven wrong by science? You boy or girl is born gay. It is a matter of chemistry of their brain. GUESS WHAT, GOD MADE THEM THAT WAY. So how do you disown a child for something that god choose form them to endure as their own cross? It was not a choice as moron religious leaders like to say, it is biological. Now if they claim non binary either beat them until until you get rid of the stupidity put in them by the liberal teachers or disown them. There are two genders and two sexs. Gay is ok, wanting to change your sex to the one you feel better as, fine as long as you jump through all the hopes. But if your nonbinary you should be committed or shut the fuck up. Everyone has days where they don't feel right in their own body most the time it is a hangover, or your the man and you don't want to do the dad thing or your the woman and you don't want to do the mom or girlfriend thing. Get the fuck on with your life and do what you need to do to be happy that day. But if you tell me I have to honor so dumb ass pronoun choice you made, go fuck yourself. Your feelings and your whims are not my worry. Grow the fuck up and decide to be a real human like you are.
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James
God is love... Love has NO bearing on one "being" gay. Most gay tendencies can be traced to the gut bacteria / flora (which is considered the 2nd brain in humans).
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James
Read all the gut & brain articles on the Mercola site. Get a feel for the copious ways gut health can influence emotional, spiritual, mental and physical health... https://search.mercola.com/results.aspx?q=gut%20and%20the%202nd%20brain#stq=gut - AND - https://search.mercola.com/results.aspx?q=flora%20%26%20gay#stq=flora & gay
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Roy L. Patterson
You can love a person and hate their sinful nature. Homosexuality is a sin in God's eyes. People can change. I know of two former Gay people that have changed with God's help.
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Carl Elfstrom
I bet if your god tried some homosexuality he would change his mind. Nothing major to start. Just a little dick. And if you ever want to try it with a bigger one let me know, babe!
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flugo
Your reply, Carl, is blasphemous. How you can insult, defy, and malign the Holy, Righteous Loving God as you do is beyond understanding. . . . . and downright filthy-minded.. I am offended by the way you characterized my Heavenly Father. Your ONLY safe recourse is to repent of your ignominious foul concept of God now.
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Carl Elfstrom
I'm tickled pink by your response, Bob! Pleased to meet you. Won't you guess my name?
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Carl Elfstrom
Bob, my God doesn't like your god.
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Lori
Now Carl...I don't think it's necessary to taunt these closed minded folks. They really do live in their book and accept it, good, bad or whatever. They cannot see anything beyond it, so have a bit of sympathy.
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James
@ Lori Mongillo. KUDOS.... Almost right on... If they not believe it they would never see it (as they do). its called Phaneron.
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James
Its NOT possible to insult "god". God has no ego like humans do to "FEEL" insulted. GOD = LOVE.. one can NOT sin against love. We only sin against ourselves.
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Lori
Oooo.. very nice!
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flugo
Right on, Roy.
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preacher richard h.
So true Roy its a Choice an a little Brainwashing over the last 50 years.
Look its a Disease like Alcoholism they" Quit One Day at a Time"
If a person Chose Not to act Out they could look in the Mirror an repeat this Phrase everyday
" I'm NOT going to be Gay, JUST FOR TODAY"
Problem Solved
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Lori
Perhaps Pastor Richard, you can try that. JUST FOR TODAY, I'm NOT going to be a brainwash Christian! You have been brainwashed your entire life. You don't realize it until you try to leave Christianity. It took me two years to shake the guilt trips and scripture BS. It IS brainwashing, whether you believe it or not. I don't think that's what Jesus wanted it to be.
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Rog
Bi people switch, gay people are gay.... Can you change from straight to gay...? In the Bible, God hated the act of the staight people having gay sex, not gay people in a loving committed relationship... How can straight people judge gay relationships when they haven't mastered it themselves... broken marriges, abuse, and then children are from broken homes... That list is endless... Clearly on all accounts they are living without God. Isn't God what a true relationship is all about? If a person could not or did not want sex, but wanted to share their life with someone of the same gender, is that wrong to love that partner? Is it anyone's place to judge that? As we get older, sex often stops, the love does not if it is real and with God. If there was no such thing as sex, I know I am with the one I love and nothing and no one will change that. No one has the right to make others lie that they are now staight just to please others... You would also be lying to God not to mention possibly bringing children into this messed up mix... Then one day you realize you have been lying to everyone and break up the family... Stop making people do that! Why does that have to be so flipping trivial for so many to grasp decade after decade... Trust me, we all have many things to fix in our own lives, work on those and leave others to theirs... If anyone ever masters their own life and has all the answers for everyone else, then you must be the messiah, just say'n.
Work on finding and then become yourself with God... For those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind... Stop protecting those who mind, if you lie just to please others, you are actually hurting yourself, others and God... Come to God even if you are broken, he loves you just as much because you came to him.
God bless us all.
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Carl Elfstrom
Thanks, Tiny Tim.
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Carl Elfstrom
Thankyou very much,Rog. I can definitely, very much relate to that.
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James
@ Rog... God hated the act of the straight people having........... Let me see if I get this. GOD hates ??? Is that even possible? GOD is LOVE ~ How can LOVE hate ? Talk about a conflict, a oxymoron. Biblical teachings (as mistranslated as they are) are viewed w/ some far out phaneron to make said claim... "GOD hates". LOL. Kinda rips the grain of a "loving god" who GAVE/ permits FREE WILL choices. Why give free will then hate ppl for excersizing god given free will?
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flugo
Wake up, James: God DOES hate! Leviticus 20:23 - sin; Psalm 11:5 - the wicked; Proverbs 6:18-19 - 7 things; and John 3:36 speaks of the wrath of God. These are just a few references to God's anger, hatred, & wrath. So, please do your homework before showing your ignorance.
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Jeff
The parents were wrong. Homosexuality is a sin, but so is breaking one of Christ's two most important commandment, and that is to love your neighbor as yourself, doesn't say love your straight neighbor or your white neighbor. Now they can let their child know that his activity is a sin and they do not approve of it but they must still love him and forgive him.
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flugo
Excellent Biblical observation!
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Carl Elfstrom
Beware of those who quote religious texts and scripture with forked tongues. They seek to rule through distortion and misinterpretation of truth. They won't last long. We have been sent to send them back to Hell, where they came from.
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James
Exactly, Love they neighbor as thy self. What is a SIN? who is to make said claim of where the human interpretation is to be drawn? If it IS a sin to any one, they their path. I'm sure we can all point a finger to draw attention from our sins as we lime light other ppls sins. Pot calling the kettle black in many way at many time. "PS; It is NOT possible to sin against god, only our selves.
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preacher richard h.
I have never read so many SELF SERVING COMMENTS Twisting GODS Word to Justify a Life of sin. Jesus doesn't demand we forgive Sinners Or False teachers .or those who Don't practice GODS word, in fact We are suppose to talk to them about their sin an if they continue we are to use Righteous Judgement an Basically stay away so we are not pulled into Sin. or evil deeds.
Jesus is the one who Forgives Sin An as to BOB
GOD Doesn't Hate , GOD Doesn't TOLERATE SIN ,It is Punishable by Death. DEATH Meaning Forever out of GODS GRACE. That's why JESUS Had to die an was Forsaken on the cross ,Only a Divine Being one without SIN could Pay the Price for the SINS of Man.
Like Jesus told the Fornicater, adulterous who was to be Stoned He forgave her SIN but he TOLD her to Go AND SIN NO MORE.
You cant keep doing the Same SIN and EXPECT to Keep being Forgiven.
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Ben Tousey
As someone who spent fifteen years in Reparitive Therapy, I have one request. Let's stop calling these people "Christians." These people are everything Jesus opposed while he was here. Let's just call them what they are... Pharisees... looking to destroy the love of God and harm the very people Jesus valued most.
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Ben Tousey
P.S. Every time love wins out... It gives me hope. I hope that Seth will find peace in his life and experience life as joyful and wonderful... You deserve that my friend.
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flugo
Ben: Just who are these 'people Jesus valued most'? Please justify your assertion.
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Carl Elfstrom
Bob, you sound like you think you're an expert on the bible so you must know who Ben is talking about. It must hurt deep to know that you aren't one of them.
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Lori
I wasn't actually there, but from what I've read, Jesus loved and offered healing to anyone that came to him. He DID seem to have a problem with the arrogant attitudes of those who felt they were superior and self-righteous. It seems that those who were humble and kind, and DID NOT make judgments, that only elevate their own egos, would have been held in high esteem by him. (Of course, that only applies to those who understand the function of an over active ego and what arrogant's truly looks like. Some folks can't see it at all). This young man is truly a person with a sense of direction and is moving forward even though he has been shunned, because he's different from his parents religious community. He is NOT the sinner here. CAN ANY of the Christian folk here, honestly say that God ISN'T the one who makes people different?
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Bill Fox
Why didn't he tell his parents when he was five, ten, or even fifteen?
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Brotherhood1
I am so glad things worked out for this fine young man,minus the parental thing. I am a minister of full faith and true words of our heavenly father and do my best to do his work. This includes what is sent by those words of "(Jesus) I never told you to hate anyone" and "ALL are welcome to my in my "church"" I tend to all sheep and the majority of my congregation are part of the LGBT community. We all seek out the word of God and am pleased to do such thing. Why shut out those who seek the Holy Ghost if they are true believers? That would be going AGAINST the wishes of God.That would be putting the sheep out for the wolves to devour.
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flugo
You, Arnold . . . . a 'minister'? 'of true words of our heavenly father'? Please list the chapters and verses where 'our heavenly father' said 'I never told you to hate anyone.' and 'ALL are welcome to my in the 'church''.
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Brotherhood1
Yes, a minister. Otherwise I would not be commenting on this post. Ans as far as verses in "todays" bible the way it has been butchered, those inlets do not exist anymore. What we have today is blind religion. Gather up bibles from different secs of this organized religion and you will see so much of a difference. My statement is intended for ALL humanity, not the pick and choose ones. And what words from a minister as of yourself. I thought compassion was to be part of what we do. Oh,..wait,...I forgot,...you are part of the religious war being a member of the organized religion. I do the works of our heavenly father and tend to ALL the sheep,not just those who seek false profits and such. So as a question to you,sir. Would you turn away any human who seeks the word of God or to be selective and only share the good word to those YOU think are worthy? Dig and seek the real truth. It's there for the finding. I have attended many theological institutes ,one on biblical history, and am glad to have attended. If you do not know the whole truth,then the best thing is to keep your mouth shut so say. I am not up for debate or things of such. Remember our constitution here in the states,"Freedom of speech and religion." True history lessons are worth the while.This my last response and only response I am making. I am not in the government which means on my part I do not attend any form of debates.
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flugo
Heh-heh!
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Brotherhood1
Yes,me a minister. And it's John. If you are a minister, which I highly doubt,then where is your compassion? Prime example you are showing is the organized religion everyone else is trying to run away from. And as far as me saying all are welcome in my church, that was me saying that,and about I never told you to hate anybody,that is all over in the bible. Do some research and re-read the bible. So tell me,did Jesus ever turn anyone away? No,not even the non-believers. He accepted everyone. It is today's religion and the religious war that has one against the other. If you do not like truth and such,then maybe you are in the wrong field.
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flugo
Arnold: You'd do well to not advertise your ignorance by mis-characterizing Jesus: 'He accepted everyone.'
Yeah, He was really accepting of the money changers He kicked out of the temple. Yeah, He is very accepting of those He will say 'Depart!, I never knew you!' Matthew 7:23, :25-:41. And, He really appreciated those He called pigs, dogs, false prophets in Matthew 7:6, :15-:16.
AND, by the way . . . God does hate, contrary to your blather. (Psalm 11;5, John 3:36, Psalm 16:30, plus others) Those whose life is to emulate Jesus and live Godly lives will practice the life style portrayed in the Scriptures. Christians are to hate un-Godly practices and wicked behavior.
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Jason B
I will give him a place to stay, and - a big suprise, too!
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Gimmel Yod
FACT: The only commentary the Scriptures have regarding same-gender relations are POSITIVE. FACT: Since the KJV, the Scriptures have been increasingly MIStranslated to create a bias against same-gender attractions where absolutely none exist in the source-language texts. FACT: Peter warned about those who would misrepresent what Paul wrote and that misrepresentation is most dangerous when people with no understanding of the Hebrew Torah read Romans chapter 1. FACT: The Scriptures say NOTHING about "Lesbianism" whatsoever (And if you think Romans 1 says anything about it then it simply means that my previous point about needing to understand the Hebrew Torah to understand Romans 1, applies to you)! Want to know the facts as opposed to the old lies commonly spouted by fundamentalist blow-hard religious zealots? http://g0ys.org/newthang.htm
Boy. Wow. yay. "His parents were shocked" to find out he was gay? Absentee parenting. Free school? Good forhim, hope he does something productive with his degree......
It's very rough to tell your parents that you are not what they thought you were, or would accept you as being, especially while living at home. When I was eighteen I called my mother on the phone and told her a secret about me that she was totally appalled by and pretty much excommunicated me from the family. So I called her right back and told her I was joking, which is what she wanted to hear, so she accepted it, and welcomed me back into the family. I didn't mention it to her again for a few decades, until she was mature enough to hear it, and I could handle rejection. We're now best of friends and talk on the phone everyday. And she didn't even have to quit being a Christian. My hat's off to this young man. He's much braver than I was at his age, and will be in my prayers.
Carl...very well said...it is wonderful that you are now close...Peace...Tom
Just figured out how to put MY kid t5hrough College Thanks