Last week we talked about some churches who have refused to follow the Center for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) guidelines for the coronavirus and have continued holding large services in their churches.
Now one of the church leaders we highlighted, evangelical pastor Rodney Howard-Browne, has been arrested by the Hillsborough County Sheriff’s Department after continuing to ignore a countywide order directing residents to remain at home except for “essential services” such as going to the grocery store or visiting a doctor.
County Sheriff Chad Chronister charged the pastor of the River at Tampa Bay Church with two second-degree misdemeanors: unlawful assembly and a violation of health emergency rules. Chronister and the department's attorneys repeatedly urged Howard-Browne to close his church prior to his arrest and sent police to his church on Sunday morning to speak with him but he "did not make himself available," according to Chronister.
Florida currently has nearly 6,700 confirmed cases of the coronavirus and at least 87 deaths.
'Florida Man' At It Again
The day before his arrest, Howard-Browne held two services at his megachurch which normally holds 4,000 congregants. A video on the church’s Facebook page of the day’s sermon shows a large number of attendants although it does not appear that the venue was full.
One of Howard-Browne's attorneys issued a statement after the arrest claiming the church “went above and beyond any other business to ensure the health and safety of the people" in attendance by providing everyone with hand sanitizer, having staff wear protective gloves, and by requiring those in attendance to stay 6 feet away from those outside their household.
Sheriff Chronister on the other hand called the decision to hold services a “reckless disregard for human life” in a strong condemnation of the pastor's actions.
No Stranger to Alternative Facts
Howard-Browne has presented numerous conspiracy theories about the virus during his sermons, and has been adamant about his church remaining open despite numerous calls from the Sheriff’s Department and their attorneys.
One conspiracy he's put forth is that the coronavirus pandemic is a globalist plot engineered by the Rockefeller Foundation to force deadly vaccines on people and shut down churches.
The pastor was also a member of the evangelical leaders who laid hands on and prayed in the Oval Office with President Trump in 2017 and has said his church won't close during the current pandemic because, as he put it, "we're raising up revivalists, not pansies."
Howard-Browne also claims he will rid Florida of the coronavirus entirely - an apparent repeat of an earlier performance where he claims his prayers rid Florida of the Zika Virus. However, as he mentions in the video above, his prayer-powers apparently stop at the Florida state line. As he puts it, "I can't be responsible for every city, or whatever."
Religious Freedom vs. Public Safety
All indications show that Howard-Browne will contest the charges by claiming that forcibly closing churches is in violation of his right to freedom of religion, as he has previously stated his intent to take the issue “all the way to the Supreme Court” if churches were told to close.
Legal experts have been skeptical of the pastor’s claims as the social distancing recommendations from the CDC serve the government and public interest of public safety.
State Attorney Andrew H. Warren said during a press conference, "It's unfortunate here that the pastor is hiding behind the First Amendment" and later added that the emergency orders put in place by the county are “constitutionally valid.”
Meanwhile a statement posted March 22nd by the church on their website makes the case that their religious freedom is being violated by these closures.
"The government deciding who can attend a service by way of a numerical limit does not demonstrate an equality of rights and ought to be seen as a per se violation of the principle of separation of church and state," said the statement.
Should churches be able to defy emergency orders in the name of religious freedom? Does public safety take precedence over holding Sunday services?
And in the age of digital streaming, is there any excuse for continuing to hold in-person church services during a deadly pandemic?
80 comments
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Kaylin Elise Somavia
Faith in your diety does not need to be done in a crowded building at any time, but especially when lives are put at an unnnecessary risk. Your diety hears the prayers of the righteous from your house of worship or your kitchen if those prayers are from the soul. What religious leader would put the people who put their faith in them to lead them in harms way for publicity. They should be leading by example and help keep their following healthy, ensuring the members have food and elderly are checked on more than usual and insuring they are available for now by phone for spiritual council. Roll up your sleeves and work to help, close your mouth if nothing intellegent is going to come out. Contrary to what we see faith is not a business.
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Lyle
Well yes as Christians we have a right to worship God be in church and so forth. But with the coronavirus being a deadly disease to some people at their social distancing is very important. But the one stopping you from having church or worship God. You just can't be in the same room right now. But there is such things as Skype Facebook Messenger video chat you still could hold church I'll worship god without being on top of each other infecting one another or possibly infected one another. God will always be there Jesus will always be there and people will always be there. It does not mean that the church building is the church it's where one or more are gathered there is God so as people of the world or of nature with belief in God religion and so forth. There is alternative way they may not be the way you want it right now but it's important that yeah Church religion worship of God is important. And there's many alternative ways whether it's online or through video or movies so you're not abandon abandoning your Christian views or religious views but be smart be safe be healthy.
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Flora Michelle Williams
Isaiah 26:20/Jeremiah 17:10 God has allowed man to create these viruses because the world has turned away from God. God test the heart and examine the mind. The quarantine has revealed the wicked. Until the arrogant and bigots turn from their wicked ways, we will stay in quarantine waiting for God to heal the land. I have seen some birds that I haven’t seen before. The sky is beautiful and blue. The pollution from vehicles, corporations, and man has subsided.
Pastors who are not using the various social media to reach anyone is not really called by God. God has made a way, but if a religious leader hasn’t figured that out, I know that you will die.
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Flora Michelle Williams
Some pastors have killed off their congregations and themselves by being disobedient. God has called us to be obedient to our government to a certain extent. Jesus paid his taxes, and he encouraged his disciples to follow the rules of the law. I believe that the pastor may have some conspiracy theories. Dr. Faucci and Bill Gates are at the forefront of where the virus come from, according to conspiracy theories. China is not taking the blame. We don’t have a pandemic team large enough for this kind of outbreak in America. The president fired key people who controlled previous virus. We will have to vote him out to restore order to the world. America is the leader of the free world, and we will loose that status if Trump gets another 4 years.
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W Gene Simmons
Police are right.. Church is not Essential.. Stay home like they and Pray there...
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Kevin Michael Meyer
We are called to be peaceful not unruly. Majority of churches across this nation have found other media outlets to stay connected to their congregations. They are not saying we cannot enjoy religious services; just to do so in different ways for the safety of others. A good shepherd protects his sheep.
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Akhil Jojo
My self Dr Akhil Jojo As a medical student and an orthodox practicioner of wizadry. Covid 19 ie Sars corona 2 via novel corona virus can spread from person to person via contact.on the grace of our lord Jesus we may remain un infected or asymptomatic. But we still remain as carrier of the causative organism and disease. As per our ordination we all the ministers , pastors and wizards are carrier of the power via the life force and grace from the supreme power. As bible says its given to us as a grand and give it as the same. So we are not the true owners. But we are just the. Portal of grace. According to my personal view. We all the ordinated members should do our service by offering prayer and do ing penince for all the world. By prayer, by castings we can give strength to the virus to spread as well as the humanity to face the judgment of the almighty in more rapid and successful way. So we shall remain in our prayer room, stay alone and become the voice of all in front of god the almighty.
May god thy almighty goodness bless all of u.
On behalf of my orientation and holy sprit dwell in me may all of u get the good vision and guidance to face this situation. And do what we have to be done in this occasion as a social being.
In the name of the father, son and the holy spirit .
Amen.
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James Earl Montgomery
Freedom of religion was not stepped on, if you have to be in a building risking many people's lives then you might want to do some praying for guidance, because that is not religion.
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Jennifer Rebecca Lovsey
Better wake up and stop being sheep! Your govt. will no longer simply "tolerate" ANY kind of opinion that differs from their NWO mandates.
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Richard Lee Cornell
The lack of understanding how a flu works seems to be universal. This newest flu is killing older people. Many people over the age of 60 have underlining health problems. There is a book by David L. Heymann on dieases those that will attack humans. This pastor is not thinking about this new virus and who can die from it. Just look at Wuhan China where most of those who die were over 60. Most people dieing from this virus in the US are those over 60 with health problems. Afterlife2.org
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John P Maher
LOCK HIM UP for ATTEMPTED MURDER
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Jennifer Rebecca Lovsey
Typical tool, go back to living in fantasyland.
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Machion Samuel Garrison III
We can consider acting in accordance to our answer to the following questions: For Christians - Am I being a servant or am I being selfish? For Non-Christians - Am I being an asset or am I being a liability?
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Patrick Gabriel
I am Minister Patrick, so sorry evangelical pastor Rodney Howard-Browne, but in this case you are wrong you deserve to go to jail and pay for your sins here on earth just as if you were paying for your sins with Jesus Christ. We are all human God has made each and everyone of us in his image. However that being said but in this case you are wrong you deserve to go to jail and pay for your sins here on earth just as if you were paying for your sins with Jesus Christ. We are all human God has made each and everyone of us in his image. However that being said humans are flawed creatures each and everyone of us no one is above the other we all have rules to live by. The Bible tells each and everyone of us to give unto God what is God's but to give man or government what is their's in this case we have a rules to live by to protect each and everyone of us. No one man is above man's law whether you're a pastor of a church for the presentThe Bible tells each and everyone of us to give unto God what is God's but to give man or government what is their's in this case we have a rules to live by to protect each and everyone of us. No one man is above man's law whether you're a pastor of a church or the the leader of a government. We all need to listen to obey. Now I am a firm believer a meeting with your congregations every week as a minister I dothe leader of a government. We all need to listen to obey. Now I am a firm believer a meeting with your congregations every week as a minister I do meet with my congregation on a weekly basis. I am not the lead minister of our congregation but I do assist the leaders of our congregation and we have set up a zoom conferencing for social hours and we are recording church services which have been going on for three weeks now meet with my congregation on a weekly basis. I am not the lead minister of our congregation but I do assist the leaders of our congregation and we have set up a zoom conferencing for social hours and we are recording church services which have been going on for three weeks now and everybody is raving about the contact did our church has done to reach out to each and every parishioner. So yes I am sorry Evangelical pastor Rodney Howard-Browne, you need to obey the rules just like every one of us you are not above man's long because you're a evangelical pastor. You are a man first and man's laws are the rules of the land right now! If my church and congregants can meet via computer soak in yours stay home I don't want your dirty air!You are a man first and man's laws are the rules of the land right now! If my church and congregants can meet via computer soak in yours stay home I don't want your dirty air!
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The Rev. William C, Millhouse
These guys are not true Christians. They worship The Almighty Dollar. If they insist on flaunting the law, lock them up. If they insist on preaching politics let them pay their fair share as in paying taxes on their income. If they refuse attach their assets.
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Michael G Woram
I thought we were done with religions that required human sacrifice.
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Jerry M Choat
{Proverbs 22:3.The shrewd one sees the danger and conceals them self, But the inexperienced keep right on going and suffer the consequences.
The Bible advises us to think ahead. By doing so, we can cautiously avoid situations that could undermine our goals, and we can thus actively put ourselves in more favorable situations.
Local authorities often implement precautions or restrictions for public health. It is good to keep informed and comply with the government’s directives.
{Romans 13:1 Let every person be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 those who have taken a stand against it will receive judgment to themselves.
Therefore you who opposes the authority has taken a stand against the arrangement of God.”
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Edgar Reed
What would Jesus do? What do his teachings show? I don't think it's that complex. Wouldn't he try to show his love for all the community as best he could?
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Jerry M Choat
{Proverbs 22:3.The shrewd one sees the danger and conceals them self, But the inexperienced keep right on going and suffer the consequences.
The Bible advises us to think ahead. By doing so, we can cautiously avoid situations that could undermine our goals, and we can thus actively put ourselves in more favorable situations.
Local authorities often implement precautions or restrictions for public health. It is good to keep informed and comply with the government’s directives.
{Romans 13:1 Let every person be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 those who have taken a stand against it will receive judgment to themselves.
Therefore you who opposes the authority has taken a stand against the arrangement of God.”
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Robert H Donahue
I do believe that the designation of essential businesses was very arbitrary (like liquor stores and gun shops), but at least in those venues it is possible to adhere to social distancing guidelines. I don't think it's realistic to expect to have church services and maintain social distancing. Thus, I think the correct decision was made. The pastor's belief in conspiracy theories is just another example of the number of people who are willing to believe in things that have no basis in fact (where facts are actually available - as opposed to believing in a higher power based upon faith and for which there is not a definitive answer). When people ignore facts or dismiss facts as "fake" or refuse to listen to facts, but just attack the speaker, there is no hope of having any type of constructive dialogue.
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Trent Bradley Kischook
I don't understand why the pastor would insist on breaking the law. It is my opinion, and I could be wrong, that you don't need to attend church to worship God. If you require proof that Christ exists all you have to do is go for a walk in a park, forest or anywhere else where there is nature. God is great, and all the wondrous things on this planet is proof of that. I have known far too many people that consider themselves good Christians, have to have the front pew in church, but once they leave church, they forget what they have been taught and break most of the commandments on a daily basis. Again, it is just my opinion.
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Randy C Hamilton
A park means Nature, Not Religion. Also what about the 4000+ other gods created by man? How do you know yours exists? Any emperical proof? I thought not. Learn to think for yourself. Preachers, etc are takers. Tell them to get real jobs and stop selling "heaven insurance." The biggest scam ever.
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Allen Nace
The public safety factor overrides the religious freedom factor. Short and sweet. I favor all kinds of freedoms but not when they endanger the public. This persons thinking and those like him endanger the public. They start by endangering their congregation by playing on faith and belief in a way that benefits them or their ego but is not beneficial to the people they supposedly serve. Doing this is like holding a service dressed in black on a highway at night and telling the people that God will protect them. If they die it was Gods will. No, it was the result of listening to an ego driven sociopath.
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George A Cancilla
It's not that the government wants to stop religious freedom. It is not only church gathering that are being affected. If it were then I would have to say its wrong. But everyone is supposed to be in quarantine not just religious people. I live in butler pa and I ran to the store last week. It was so sad to see how many people think this isn't real or it's a joke. They did follow the six foot guide lines or even where masks. Religious or not at least respect each other and yourself enough to try and be safe. God Bless the world.
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Thomas Andrew Connell
The funny thing about science is that it’s real whether you believe in it or not.
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Maria
News flash!!!! GOD is everywhere NOT just in church. He’s probably missing his donations!!! Some of the most hypocritical people I know go to church! No thank you, I prefer loving and worshiping God at home where I normally do!
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Lionheart
Thank you for the news flash Maria. I hope it wasn’t on CNN because that’s often fake news. Was it on the BBC because they are fairly reliable. Whichever news it was on I’m most interested in knowing if it said which god it was, and what did they mean by saying it’s everywhere because I’m just having a little bit of trouble trying to understand that? I’m actually hoping it’s not that bible god because he’s got a very mean jealous streak in him. I think I can cope if it’s a goddess because I’m sure she’ll be kinder, so I wait on baited breath for your reply. I just switched on the tv to hear the news but they didn’t say anything so perhaps the news of the god declaration might be on in a bit.
🦁❤️
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flugo
'mire': So, you worship at home because there are hypocrites in the church. How consistent are you?! Do you avoid grocery stores, fuel stations, doctors' offices, etc. because of the hypocrites there? Pull your head out!
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Patricia Ann Wileman
There are hypocrites at Walmart and other places of business. But I bet you still go there. So this is the best thing that I can tell you if you’re worried about the one sitting next to if there a hypocrite. Get your eyes off of them and get your eyes on the Lord. Being a Christian is a personal relationship with the Lord not a building. However drunk hang out with like-minded people at the bars or drinking with others. Like-minded people in all walks of life hang out with like-minded people. Are they all hypocrites no but there’s some. People who go to church hang out with like-minded people and yes there’s hypocrites but you don’t have to hang out tight with them. So you have a nice day and be careful calling Christians hypocrites. Because you stepped right into that one. 
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flugo
Right on!
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Sandra Lynn Shorey
We strive for peace, why make a loud noise to be seen, talk to your groups as told by social distancing and move on. By phone by Skype . STOP the pressing against rules and for a while make it work with your groups. We're not going to be in this long. Prayer and all of us will be safe. One day at a time Friends. You know what is , is already ordained to happen and Prayers and healing thoughts will make each person's day Great.
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Amber Fry
Good religious leaders look after their congregation. As much as it means sharing the words of their holy books, it also means making sure they are not unnecessarily risking that congregation they are tending to. It means trusting those that are really and truly faithful to continue practices in accordance to the beliefs and teachings of the church while at home while it's necessary to be practicing this social distancing. It isn't forever and if the faith is really that strong then it shouldn't be an issue when this thing is finally managed properly and these necessary rules are loosened. Any spiritual leader that insists on staying open for mass gatherings is running on pride, not faith. I seem to recall that being one of the worst of sins.
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John Palmer
Thank you. Makes perfect sense to me.
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Miguel Anthony Richard Denyer
18 U.S. Code § 241.Conspiracy against rights If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; ... They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from... they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.
So, it turns out that due to this pesky little document known as the US Constitution, the Pastor is correct and, despite good intentions, the Sheriff is wrong... but then the road to hell IS paved with good intentions.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Tear down that evil Christian Church, and crucify the pastor !!!
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Patricia Ann Wileman
So you are the perfect person so you can throw the first stone. Who do you know is an evil Christian church. Do you know them personally. Have you talk to the person that you you call evil personally. Everyone has free choice. Not every church I feel is where I belong. But do I say they’re evil no. Hearsay someone else telling you and you’re not technically knowing personally is the evil person listening and re-speaking. Do I think everyone should go to the church not necessarily. However I’m not going to tell you or anyone else that a pastor is evil. And if someone doesn’t want to go it’s usually broadcast also. However I’m sure that the evil people are in Walmart and the grocery stores. The evil people are at the liquor stores buying beer . and I’m gonna tell you not necessarily are they all evil but guess what you’re right next to somebody. But the church is evil but you don’t have a problem going to the stores or the liquor store or wherever you feel you need to go Pharmacy. And places they sell pot to get high it’s a necessity so it’s OK to go there and be by somebody or near somebody.  so you pick and choose who the evil person is I’m not. However I am going to leave it in Gods hands to take care of me. Not too impressed with the. Nancy Pelosi in March she’s telling people to go to Chinatown and go shopping and see the parade and that’s near San Francisco, CA by the way. She didn’t have any common sense. Do I think the Chinatown was bad no but we were supposed to not be doing that.  there were some common sense that went out the door right there with one of the top people trying to make laws. So who’s the evil person. She’s part of the government. So have a nice day be careful what you say
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Nobody can see anything through God's eyes. We can only see through our own eyes, and perceive through our own thoughts. So come down off your high horse. Opinions are like ***holes. We all have one, and they all stink !
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John Palmer
Are all opinions odious???
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John Palmer
Are all opinions odious???
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flugo
Are all odors opinionated???
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James M Slack
I can whole heartedly understand how pastor Browne feels. My question would be to him. How would he feel if some of his people came down with the virus, because he held services when told not too. I believe in Gods eyes he should listen to our peers and not try to out think them. Don’t let the church people suffer at a time like this. Our Heavenly Father will understand that the pastors duty is to protect his people not to hinder them and cause sickness. God Bless all who are sick and have lost someone. Please everyone listen to the people in the know and stay home if possible. God Bless and Take Care
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Tom
Respectfully...public safety is more important than religious freedom...especially when the exercise of religious freedom puts many at risk of sickness and death...Peace...Tom B
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Val Jester
You could not be more mistaken. Take your time. Find any reference in the constitution that allows for the revocation of constructional rights for purposes of public health. That is a slippery slope you do not want to slide down.
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Val Jester
Make constructional to be constitutional
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
It sounds like it's time to amend the Constitution again.
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Charles Edward Flaker
The Bill of Rights (Amendments 1-10) can't be modified. Freedom of Religion and Peaceful Assembly are covered by the 1st Amendment. It's not possible to change this. While I agree there's no point in spreading a disease willfully, legally they can't stop you from assembling. This was a unlawful arrest.
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Rev. Sandy
Lock him up for 14 days in private quarantine.
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TarotTerry
Willful ignorance never manifest positive results.
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jpmcdunn
I wonder if it is legal to marry someone on Zoom.
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Paul J. Fumero
Evangelicals that ignore orders to stay at home should be arrested, fined and do some jail time for endangering the public.
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Val Jester
The constitution does not allow for such orders.
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DGC
I believe that the courts probably would, likely will, have a very different opinion on this matter. We have common sense restrictions on most of our rights. For instance our 1A rights do not give us the right to yell ‘fire’ in a crowded theater when there is no fire. The likelihood of people being injured or killed trying to get out restricts our right to do that. Nobody is restricting the right of these people to read their Bibles, pray, worship. They are being told they can’t do it in a crowd. We are in the midst of a pandemic. We are fighting a new very contageous deadly disease we do not have the antibodies yet to fight. Our most basic right is the right to life. Without life none of our other rights matter. Their right to congregate for any reason then circulate among others ends where the right of the rest of us to continue living begins. The founding fathers grossly underestimated the number of people who wilfully ignore common sense for selfish reasons. They would still be writing our Constitution if they’d factored in the lowest common denominators. They no doubt figured—hopefully—that we would pull together to work for our common good in situations like this rather than pursue our own selfish interests. The wants of a few do not outweigh the needs of the many.
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Charles Edward Flaker
If it's restricted, it's not a right. it's a privilege. The Constitution tells government what it cannot take, not what we can have.
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DGC
Malarkey. Our 2A gives us the right to own firearms. 2A does not us the right to shoot a place up or kill people just because we feel like it. That latter part doesn’t take away our right. It just reminds us that with our rights come responsibilities. Lack of plain old common sense—like stupidly displaying our firearms in public for effect and gathering in groups during a pandemic involving a deadly new disease—is exactly what will end losing us rights. We need to maturely and soberly exercise our rights if we want to not have them taken away.
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DGC
Malarkey. Our 2A gives us the right to own firearms. 2A does not us the right to shoot a place up or kill people just because we feel like it. That latter part doesn’t take away our right. It just reminds us that with our rights come responsibilities. Lack of plain old common sense—like stupidly displaying our firearms in public for effect and gathering in groups during a pandemic involving a deadly new disease—is exactly what will end losing us rights. We need to maturely and soberly exercise our rights if we want to not have them taken away.
I will add that had the restrictions on gathering snd social distancing been applied ONLY to religious groups my thoughts on the matter might be different. The same restrictions were applied to everyone. It only because a religious isiue when some congregations chose to exercise their rights in an immature and irresponsible manner. Several of those congregations are already experiencing outbreaks of Covid19. Germs do not recognize our Bill of Rights. It is our responsibility to protect ourselves from them as best we can. Germs LOVE groups.
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Val Jester
Comment removed by user.
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David Ciambrone
I agree. God isn't going to protect "believers". This is for public safety and that trumps the supposed rights to gather in a building and contaminate each other and more people when they leave the church feeling good about themselves. The pastor should be jailed and those in attendance should be arrested as well. If they love their fellow man so much and want to be close-Let them enjoy jail conditions.
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Val Jester
“Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.”
— Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Amber Fry
Unfortunately that was in a time where health related crises were not part of the consideration. We know more medically now then we did then. He was a learned man who would have changed his mind, or at least made a medical exception, if he spent any time at all in learning how this thing spread.
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Dennis Wayne Starr
No one is asking anyone to "give up" essential liberty of the church. All the members are at Liberty to continue to pray and exercise their to Liberty to honor and respect whatever deity they deem necessary. Benjamin Franklin, keep in mind is not the arbitrator of everything in the universe. There is always someone somewhere that has said something that a person can use as a quote to justify their own agenda. Keep in mind we are not speaking of "A Little Temporary Safety" rather a protection AGAINST DEATH.. Even though Jesus was called a carpenter, he never built or advocated for a "Church" as a building. The definition of a "church" as a separate building specifically for worship would have been foreign to the early believers, as they met in homes. The arrogance of any person, representing themselves as a religious leader, to put others in life danger in the pretense of Christianity is just absurd. Does this pastor not have an obligation to protect his "Flock" rather than exposing his "Flock" to unnecessary danger of death. If not then he is a false leader of church and men.
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DGC
“Having lived long, I have experienced many instances of being obliged by better information or fuller consideration to change opinions, even on important subjects, which I once thought right, but found to be otherwise.”. Benjamin Franklin
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David Ciambrone
The pastor was a fool. God isn't going to provide any "exemption" from the virus. He is showing his lack of intelligence.
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Ty Ford
The Lord helps those who help themselves. As to what appears in the article, I'm capable as well any any person to make flights of fancy about conspiracies, I think Howard-Browne should walk right into the fire and show us all how it's done. But for the sake of those involved with him, please make a backup plan.
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flugo
't ford': If you consider the Scriptures, you'll find God helps those who can NOT help themselves. The Bible is replete with examples of such. And, you can find many people today who will vouch for that. If we could handle life by ourselves, why do we need God?
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Lionheart
“you’ll find God helps those who can NOT help themselves.”
Where was he during the Holocaust? Where is he helping little children dying of cancer?
🦁❤️
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Amber Fry
We can help ourselves, by staying home and letting the doctors work it out. That's the real dispute here no matter what way one wishes to dress it up.
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Randy C Hamilton
We can handle life by ourselves. Millions of us atheists do. Only science and science alone (plus distancing until it finds a solution) will get us to the other side of this virus. We do not need the tooth fairy, the easter bunny, nor any gods dreamed up by men (and in the men's own image: father, etc). SO the above Holocaust, etc comment says a lot!! Thanks, Lionheart.
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David Ciambrone
God gave man a brain. The pastor needs to use it and not do stupid things like holding crowded services. He should be looking out for the welfare of his congregation and not the collecting basket.
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Minister Michael
Unfortunately these rules and safety measures are in place for the good of all human kind. Though we are all here to praise his name and allow our followers to come rejoice in his name, we are not our lord and savior, we cannot keep our lords children healthy as that would be a false hope and insecurity when our followers do fall sick because of our negligence.
Rev. Mike
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Val Jester
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/mar/25/what-good-are-constitutional-rights-if-they-are-vi/
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Dan Anderson
So, in essence, he is saying that he thinks "praising Jesus" will cure the Zika virus, so it should also do the same for Covid-19? Then, he also seems to make reference that it is not an American problem but for the rest of the world to deal with. Is that how you see it as well?
The infamous "us vs. them" attitude.
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Darryl Mizer
I guess some Christians don't consider themselves Christians unless they go to church every Sunday. Too bad they are not sensitive to others lives..
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Crucify that criminal pastor, in the name of Jesus !!!
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Randy C Hamilton
I really like the crucify thing, but I would like it better if he and all of his flock get the virus and die. That would also raise the average IQ there.
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Dennis Wayne Starr
"He and all his flock get the virus and die"? Just what are you doing here on THIS site? Do you not realize that that this is not Yahoo,Facebook or other open social site for people like you to complain and insult everyone. This is a website where people are expected to have a certain level of compassion. Maybe you should reconsider your position in life and on this website. We have enough venom from people with poor upbringing from parents without any values or ethics that passed those traits unto they offspring. If you cannot bring anything positive or constructive and your only purpose is to be confrontational and insulting, then maybe you should consider some other place to advocate your low level upbringing. YOU certainly did not raise the IQ average here.
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John D. Partin
Dennis Wayne Starr, I agree!! This is a web site where people are expected to have a certain level of compassion, but don't only tell that to people whom you think are attacking people's religion!! Try telling that same thing to Daniel Gray, who is a 1st Amendment fanatic and "thinks" that the 1st Amendment is more important than anything else and takes precedence even over people's right to be healthy and go on living, since he says that people should go into church buildings and risk getting infected and even dying from covid-19 and then go out and spread that infection and death to their family members and strangers, just because it is their 1st Amendment right to do so and nobody should keep them out of churches and infringe on their Constitutional rights!! Where is the compassion in all that?!! In case you don't know the topics that he is posting about, they are NYC Mayor Threatens Churches Holding Services During Covid-19 with Shutdown and Defying Public Health Experts, Some Churches Refuse to Close. Moral indignation and rebuking people's lack of compassion are both very well and good, but do it across the board, consistently, with everyone who isn't showing compassion, and not just with one kind of non-compassionate person.
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Patricia Ann Wileman
People have free choice. That's how it should be.
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John Palmer
Should they be allowed to run into a packed movie theater and scream Fire, fire! Run for it! ...?
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Charles Edward Flaker
If it's actually on fire, absolutely.
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Clarke A. Stillwagen
People have free will. People can chose which path to take. They also will suffer the consequences for their choices. Unfortunately in the case of a pandemic their poor choices can affect many people. Chose wisely based on circumstance and fact not on emotion. The life you save may be your own.
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this seams stupid... church groups that do use teleconferencing by definition are the non-fanatical kind that i approve of a lot more then the idiots that insist on meeting in large gaqtherings threatening all of us via corona.
also spaming porn at them is just childish... that said it's worth nothing that the abrahamic religions sexual prodishness is something i find stupid and annoying. it's a rather disgustingly pervasive meme that invades and corrupts other cultures and reinforces the religions rather supremmasist tendencies.
i am pretty sure it developed as a result of the hebrew people ladlessness since they turned to circumcition as a way of alienating themselves from other cultures to avoid absorbtion into those cultures and as a admittedly effective way of perserving their cultural identity.
Basically all pagan religions tended to treat sex as a devine act of creation. and the sex act as a comunion with the devine. Mairrage was seen as holy where as the early christian was so heavily anti-sex that most of them wanted to ban mairrages for a long time. practicality later reduced that tendency.
it's rather sad how prudish non christian cutltures have turned after being infected with this religious meme. India is a good case study of this..
Japan seams to have come out relativly unscaved though... htey still have that parade where they march that penis shrine around that relates to that story about a demon that would hide in womens netther parts and bite mens bits of lol until someone had the brigt idea of making a male part out of iron to break its teeth.
i mean that the sort of colorful intresting cultural richness we've been deprived of due to this whole sexual shame meme turning the world upside down...
it's rather sad...