Yesterday, voters in Tennessee held a special election to fill a vacant State Senate seat. The Democratic candidate, Gayle Jordan, was soundly beaten by her Republican opponent.
But in the wake of Jordan's defeat, some question whether the odds were unfairly stacked against her. If it weren't tough enough running as a Democrat in a solid red area of the U.S., Jordan's religious views put her deeply at odds with voters in the Bible Belt state.
An outspoken atheist, she serves as the director of an organization called "Recovering from Religion", which promotes atheism as a healthy alternative to those who are seeking to leave their church or religion while maintaining a moral lifestyle.
For this high crime of rejecting religious norms, Jordan endured sharp criticism from her political opponents during the lead-up to the election. Scott Golden, chairman of the Tennessee Republican Party, called her views "extreme" in a public statement and warned that Jordan "actively works to lead people away from their faith."
Targeting her lack of religious beliefs, Tennessee Lt. Governor Randy McNally labeled Jordan as a radical atheist with "dangerous" views:
In my 40+ years in politics, I've seen few candidates as dangerous as Gayle Jordan. We need to strongly reject her assault on faith and our Tennessee values. District 14 needs to send @ReevesforTN to the @tnsenate on March 13! https://t.co/GmmUcHyl3y
Randy McNally (@ltgovmcnally) March 1, 2018
Defining Extremism
Gayle Jordan was derided as "openly atheist" -- which apparently in Tennessee is proof enough she's a dangerous extremist. But what does the term "extremist" really mean? Does it apply here?
We all probably carry a loose definition of religious extremism; it involves radical believers who take extreme actions sometimes even resorting to violence in an effort to further their cause.
Extremism exists across the religious spectrum, from Islam, to Christianity, to Buddhism, and throughout many other faith systems.
But does it apply to atheism? In attempting to answer this question, it's important to draw a distinction between atheism and anti-theism. Atheism is simply a lack of belief in God/gods.
Anti-theism is an active and deliberate rejection of theism.
Sure, some atheists may also be anti-theists, but many others remain neutral on the subject. They don't hate religion, they just don't want to be a part of it. While an anti-theist might decide to lash out at religious individuals or groups, an atheist would choose to ignore them.
Are Atheists Radicals?
So what category does Gayle Jordan fall into? Does she really have a vendetta against religion? A quick glance at the Recovering From Religion website sheds doubt on that claim. It's essentially a support network for people who've become disaffected with their faith system. The website provides resources and advice for people who want to move away from religious circles. How to explain your choice to family members, how to deal with a backlash in your community, etc.
Does that sound like the work of a "dangerous" extremist?
It's no surprise that religious folks feel threatened by people like Jordan. Her group provides a way out of traditional religion a competing path that people may choose to take. Since Christian faith is a central aspect of life to many in Tennessee, this movement probably feels like an assault on moral and cultural values the very foundation of society.
On the Road to Godlessness?
Critics say that rejecting religion will lead society down a dark path toward immorality and Godlessness. As proof, they point to the bloody communist regimes of the 20th century that openly despised religion. Communist sympathizers in the U.S. also formed the "League of Militant Atheists" though the group disbanded in 1947.
Clearly religion is an incredibly positive force in many people's lives, but that's not the case for everyone. Moving away from a religious community is not a crime, and people should be free to follow their hearts without fear of being ostracized. Gayle Jordan provides a helping hand to such individuals. Is that radical and dangerous, as her opponents claim?
More broadly: is "atheist extremism" a real problem, or is this a case of manufactured fearmongering?
61 comments
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Dave
I am an atheist. I do believe that all religions are inherently unsupported by any facts. In fact, I commonly say that most people are mostly atheists, I just believe in one less magical being than you do. Do I try to convert people to atheism? No. Why would I do that? Do evangelicals try and convert me? Not any more, but I've certainly had my share of run ins with them. Does being an atheist make me an extremist? I don't think so. I'm not even sure that it's "manufactured fearmongering" as stated above. It's just that theists are worried that they might be wrong, and one of the other religions might be right. (You know, the ones they didn't grow up with and accept their particular bronze age writings.) And that worries them, so they don't want it around. Am I ordained? Yes. Man's creation.
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Dan Atatakai
Dave - I will agree with you to a minor extent: "All THEISTIC religions are inherently unsupported by facts". Non-theistic religions like Taoism, Confucianism and Buddhism, are no more based on spiritual beliefs, but social and ethical practices.
It is amazing to me how many people will claim that Atheism demands there is no God, when it is merely a lack of a belief in a deity or deities. Even Christians are atheist toward Ahura Mazda of Zoroastrianism or Shiva, Kali and Brahma of Hinduism.
Why such a lack of a belief makes one terrified of someone who does not agree 100% with their ideas, saying "We need to strongly reject her assault on faith and our Tennessee values", I do not understand.
Last little bit of a question: What is an extremist Buddhist? One who burns more than three sticks of incense in a day?
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Lea Weisenbach
Lol..I've been a Buddhist for 40 years and I was wondering the same..What is an extreme Buddhist..lol..can't stop laughing.
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Quasi
Extreme Buddhist ... silence ...
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Anna Brown
Example of extremist Buddhist:
(CNN)A senior United Nations official investigating Myanmar's ongoing crackdown against the Rohingya says she is increasingly convinced it may amount to genocide.
More than 680,000 Rohingya Muslim refugees have fled Buddhist-majority Myanmar to neighboring Bangladesh since August 2017, bringing with them stories of mass murder and destruction at the hands of the country's military.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/12/asia/myanmar-rohingya-un-violence-genocide-intl/index.html
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Swooper
Um, extremist Buddhists in Myanmar, killing, raping, pillaging, burning of villages, in order to cleanse Myanmar of a Muslim minority, the Rohingya people, and driving the survivors into Bangladesh. Yeah, I'd call that extreme.
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Anna Brown
Example of extremist Buddhist:
(CNN)A senior United Nations official investigating Myanmar's ongoing crackdown against the Rohingya says she is increasingly convinced it may amount to genocide.
More than 680,000 Rohingya Muslim refugees have fled Buddhist-majority Myanmar to neighboring Bangladesh since August 2017, bringing with them stories of mass murder and destruction at the hands of the country's military.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/12/asia/myanmar-rohingya-un-violence-genocide-intl/index.html
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Sam
Atheist are some of the most open minded people. When other religions are decisive. Atheist seem to be more excepting and inclusive. The extremist are the NRA and those that spread hate and fear in the name of their God.
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Jim D.
Sam, the NRA does not spread hate and fear in the name of "their God." Your statement implies the NRA has its own god, which just sounds silly. The NRA welcomes people of all religions, including those with no religion at all. The organization champions our rights as Americans and individuals. Yes, they do talk about certain groups that are trying to take some of our rights away, and they do make it sound scary. Maybe that's because it is scary to think we, as Americans, are all right with our rights being taken away from us.
But enough of that, since that is an off-topic subject for another time. It is correct that atheists can be some of the most open-minded people. They don't get caught up in having defend their religion as being the best religion, because they have no religion. Think of someone that is Protestant or Catholic or Jewish or Muslim. Of course they have to defend their religion as being the best one. Would someone actually admit that the religion have grown up with all these years, spent all that time in Sunday school, went through all the rituals like first communion or bar mitzvah, that their religion is only second best?... or third?... or not even in the top five?
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John Owens
The NRA are not extremists. If they were, you would be dead. That is a ridiculous thing to say. You want to call yourself open-minded and you are talking like a hypocritical bigot.
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Quasi
Ask those who died recently from assault rifles and IED bombs.
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Jim D.
Ask them what... who killed them? I can assure you their answer will not be the NRA. It could be terrorists (domestic or foreign). It could be mentally deranged killers. Either way, guns and bombs didn't kill them. People with evil in their minds and hearts did. How they did it doesn't matter.
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John Owens
Yeah. And who is going to hold that séance? Not me. I don't participate in séances.
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John Owens
They were killed by muslims and democrats. Look it up.
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Patty
A lot of atheists are not open minded. Samara not too pushy. God gave us the right to choose and if they choose not to believe in God I don’t believe they should have it shut down your throat but I also don’t believe that atheists what to say you have to do it our way and shove it down to Christians throat is wrong also. And the NRA is not extremist. I don’t know why so many people want to think that that they teach safety they don’t want to see people being killed . But for some reason people get it in their head all these crazy things. So I am a chaplain I do believe in God/Jesus and Holy Spirit. And yes I think the NRA for teaching safety to people to be able to use a gun for enjoyment of hunting target practice and self-defense. And if you think you take all the guns away from the good guys that bad guys are turning in their guns thanks again it’s not happening. so I also believe in having gun and I do one and I am licensed. I hope and I never even have to use it for defense. But I will tell you if it’s them or me I will use the gun to protect myself and my family. but God willing that hopefully he can keep the bad/evil people away from me. However the good and the bad are mixed between us all over the world. I would like to say there is no evil out there but there is. So I am thankful for like the NRA to teach safety so somebody like that teacher in the school that should never of had a gun there in the first place didn’t pull the trigger at the ceiling. Thank God it wasn’t pointed at somebody because that person did not have training I know from the NRA or that would’ve never happened. The person should to pull the clip open the chamber and locked it then he would’ve known there was nothing that could’ve happened. Whatever in the state of California he had no right to have a gun on the school grounds so he was in total I’ve been wrong and illegal for having a gun in that place. It takes a good gun to take out a bad again. I do want to person trained appropriately not like the teacher that was out of line at what he did in California. Have a nice day you now know my thoughts
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flugo
'Atheist extremism' is a real danger . . . . . but the most horrendous danger is to the atheist himself! With his last breath, he'll face this God he rejected . . . . . . . the ONLY God who offer an escape from hell!
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Dan Atatakai
bob - Why do you believe so? What danger is the atheist putting him or herself in? Do you feel the same way about Jews and Muslims who worship the same God of Abraham, but see it from a slightly different perspective?
I am not attacking. I am merely trying to understand what you are saying here.
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Alicia
The way I understand the beliefs of these Christians is this: When they refer to "god", they are talking about Jesus. If Jesus is not accepted as their savior, they cannot go to "heaven" and will burn in "hell". So, Jews and Muslims are included in those "putting themselves in danger".
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flugo
atatakaidanjp -
My basis is God's Word, the Bible. The Bible clearly points out that those who reject the God of the Bible are in peril of eternal separation from God.
I am not better than anyone else . . . . my worth is based upon the sacrificial work of Jesus on the cross.
Only God knows the hearts of mankind. Those who have never heard of Jesus, well . . . . God is fair, just and righteous and He alone will decide their eternal destiny.
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Lea Weisenbach
Bob...Jesus was not a Christian .Nor would he be today if he was here. Go smoke some weed ...please.
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Quasi
So, exactly who do you worship: God? Jesus? Some Ghost? Your Scripture? Yourself? Your Minister/Priest/Rabbi/? Your Cathedral? Power? Wealth? All of the above? BTW, "God" is just a job title. What is his/hers/its name?
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Alicia
Bob....You have your belief system, but it's not the only one. Yet, here you are, telling us all, in an off-handed way, that YOU are the one who is "right" in his beliefs. You are why those of other faiths are tired of Christians and their "holier than thou" attitudes?
I hate to break this to you, but NO ONE...not one of us on this Earth....knows for a FACT what happens when we die, yet here you are, telling Atheists that there is not only A god, but the ONLY god and that is the god an Atheist will face. How arrogant to believe that of all the belief systems in this world, yours is the ONLY way.
Yes, it's about faith. YOU believe that your god is the only one who can save you from hell, but that doesn't mean that anyone who believes differently is wrong. Your faith in your god is important to you, but did you ever think that others' faiths are important to THEM?
I'm Pagan. I believe in a higher power. I believe in a combination of creation and evolution. I DO NOT read the Bible and take it as fact. According to my born again Christian cousin, the Earth is only 6,000 some odd years old. When I asked how he can say that when there are dinosaur bones as evidence that the Earth is millions of years old, he said that these bones were "planted by Satan to make us doubt god". He believes that places like the Museum of Natural History are "evil". He, too, believes that there is only one "right". Personally, I find that dangerous.
So, Bob....you need to realize that we are all different and not all non-Christians will burn in your hell. I believe that anyone of ANY belief system...including Atheists....will be "judged" on the lives they led, not on the gods (or lack thereof) they prayed to.
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Lea Weisenbach
Amen
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Reverand Raymond Smith
Very well said! Blessed Be
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Annette
You do realize hell is a man made place that is used to instill fear and control over another human being. Christianity says that God is a loving and forgiving entity, therefore there cannot be a place known as hell. The Christian God should therefore accept everyone into “heaven” whether that person accepts God or not. The Christians use hell as a means of control. My God is eternal, unconditional love, that is what I believe. And I have every right to believe whatever I want!!
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Tom B
Atheism, in and of itself, is not extreme or dangerous...in thinking about everyone who posts on this blog, where is there a post by an atheist that generates fear or apprehension...while I believe there is a God/Universe, I can not imagine being fearful of an atheist...their view is a lot more open than the views of those constrained by religious tenets...Tom
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James
Hmm, the constitution being written by believers of a higher power, and believing that certain things are God given rights.... It does raise some flags not to believe in a higher power of some kind. If not morality and Good behavior are manmade. In my opinion, mankind is not something to have faith in. Yet we do have a separation of church and state. That is that the govt can not be of a religious;meaning support a certain faith or be against any faith. Not support the lack there of. So, are atheist dangerous? They could be, anyone could be. But from a psychological stand point they would be more likely not to have morals or decern between Good and bad behavior. Such as the 0.01% of sexually disturb people of the world. But in conclusion, any one can be dangerous It isn't a faith, or lack of that always causes the issue It can simply be that the individual wants to be dangerous.
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Dan Atatakai
James - the framers of the Constitution of the US were of different directions. Some were Christian, some were Deist and some were Atheist.
Yes, behavior and morality is subjective, not objective in nature. They are usually based on what is best for the tribe, not just the individual. When people work together, they get along together. Why would an atheist be more prone to not be moral and not understand the differences between good and bad? If you want to bring up the morality of the Abrahamic faith for example, do you believe it is moral to own slaves? How about stoning unruly children? These are just two of many "immoral" morals that the Bible teaches is good and permitted.
I look forward to your input on this issue.
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Milton
Gayle Jordan is a politician. Her political position is what the voters care about, her religious position is irrelevant. She lost because the majority do not agree with her Democratic positions on policy. If she were a Atheist Republican, she probably would have won. If she were a Christian Democrat, she probably would have lost.
This news story is no different than the recent story stating that "Mike Pence is mentally ill because he believes Jesus speaks to him." A perfect counter example showing the opposing party using a religious smear on a politician. Both smear tactics are tasteless, but I don't think it is the reason politicians win or lose.
Political values, not religious values.
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John Owens
Good points, Gilbert. Most evangelicals support Trump, but they do not see him as a paragon of virtue. He is just seen as less antagonistic to their world view than the alternative(s) would have been.
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Carl Elfstrom
My political beliefs are by far mostly Republican, and don't think my religious/spiritual affiliations have anything to do with it. Unfortunately, I am sometimes inclined to vote for members of the inferior parties when the Republican candidate seems even worse to me, as was the case in 2016. I don't like Hillary, and think our great president Clinton would have then and would still now be much better off ditching that biotch for Monica Lewenski, or some other hooker, who would also make a better president than Trump. At least we already know she would legalize the worlds oldest profession. I really don't think anyone who ran for president in 2016 would have done a good job. And one of them is proving that right now.
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John Owens
By making fools out of the left and much of the so-called right.
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Barry
I think that Religion is becoming a item From the past.People don't need Religion to be a good person. Most morals and values are taught at home. Just treat people as you want to be treated. You don't need the fear of a god to scare you into being a good person.
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Reverand Raymond Smith
As long as it harms none, do what you wilt
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Rick Plymale
It's refreshing to see the majority of comments supporting the idea that Atheism isn't the boogie man under the bed. I am Atheist and have been since my teens. I'm in my 60's now and have managed to survive several life-threatening events without turning to a higher power for salvation and survival. I am also ordained by ULC as a Minister, because the organization accepts people of ALL beliefs, not just Christianity. I have lawfully officiated weddings between those who choose not to use religious officiants. Are they not entitled to be wed unless they embrace some organized faith ? Of course not. They have the same rights as those who encapsulate themselves within a set of rules and systemic beliefs.
This being said, I have practiced as close to morality as humanly possible, with my shortcomings, not uncommon among those who "thump the Bible" (if you'll pardon the phrase). I treat everyone with respect and consideration and help others wherever I can without consideration of whether or not their beliefs parallel mine. I've never made any attempt to lead anyone away from their beliefs, and from the looks of it, neither has this politician. I've seen much more judgment, hate, and disrespect of others coming from the "theist" arena than I have from those who adopt no particular faith. For the most part, Atheists are much more accepting of others' views than those who actually have a decided view of what one should believe in.
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John Owens
A theist only has to believe in one big bang. An atheist has to believe in four. The bang when the first matter came into being. The bang when all the elements developed. The bang when life began. The bang when sentient beings became introspective and creative. Yeah. Atheism is real scientific.
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Lea Weisenbach
Lol
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John Owens
The danger of atheism is that human life is just like animal life and has no more value than an animal. Morality, values, ethics, honor, dignity are all fluid, depending on circumstances and mood. The idea that humans can adequately and fairly govern their own behavior and decide for themselves what is good and evil. That was what the forbidden fruit yielded. Yeah. Extreme.
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katy wall
wait so you are pretty much admitting you'd run around committing murder, theft, rape, etc. if you didn't think an imaginary parent was going to punish your ghost? Oooof, talk about extremism!!! Please stay the hell away from me or any of my friends and family. There are plenty of moral people like me that don't share in your delusion, and plenty of people that do share in your delusion that are incredibly immoral. Kinda seems like your argument isn't valid based on that fact alone, and it's scary as hell knowing there are people like you walking around right on the verge of being terrorists because of their theism.
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John Owens
Yeah. You're just a miracle yourself. Proof that jackasses CAN talk. And you fool yourself into thinking you believe in science. What a jerk.
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John Owens
I didn't admit to any such thing.
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John Owens
Apparently you need a dictionary, too, to define extremism. It isn't just whatever you imagine it is, which is what you are doing here-- imagining things. And don't you worry, you couldn't pay me to socialize with you, and beyond that, I cannot imagine that you could be highly moral, since you are obviously hormonally imbalanced, and therefore unstable. I also do not know to which delusion you are referring, since you are delusional yourself. How you come to the hysterical conclusion that I am on the verge of being a terrorist at all is a quantum leap in lack of logic. See a gynecologist or something.
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biblical scholar
But you literally did say that without theism, humans would run around not knowing good from evil. So you did admit you would murder, rape, steal, etc if you didn't believe in God.
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John Owens
I said no such thing, Colon. You heard the voices in your head say that.
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William Waugh
So, god is a communist ruler and animals are automatons! ........pls friend a scientist
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John Owens
Animals are automatons, pretty much. They run on instinct, not creativity. You speak ignorantly.
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John A Anderson, CD, CIF Mons ON
Atheists are a danger, because they think for themselves, rather than listening to what someone standing in front of them says, telling them what to think. THAT'S the danger. Of course, to those in the Bible Belt, I am a danger, because I am non-Christian, although I look, sound, and have the name of a WASP.
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Lea Weisenbach
I've been a Buddhist for more than 40 years. The funny thing is..People have no clue what Buddhism is about!! They don't know we don't beleive in a creator. So to prevent a uncomfortable situation..in an Atheist.
And what is sad..My Christian friends talk to me when they have problems because I'm not judgmental...The bible belt has the highest in venereal disease...sad ..I do beleive that religion sits next to mental illness...
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Carl Elfstrom
I studied Buddhism for a couple of years , and more again since, and am clueless to why Buddhism would be mentioned in a conversation about religion, or lack there of. To the best of my ability to comprehend, Buddhism is not a religion, but simply a way of beiñg. Why not include twelve step programs or being an Amway distributor, at least on the level of diamond direct. Atheism too has nothing to do with religion, but is simply a lack of belief in God. There are some religions and spiritual paths, such as this ministry, that welcome atheists into its membership,as so do I. And considering what I've read of the Satanic Bible (now into my third copy of it, with a beautiful introduction written by Magus Peter H. Gilmore), if you don't have atheistic views you can't best a Satanist. The ULC and I also welcome Satanists (and even Amway distributors). Even though I believe in Pagan gods and goddesses, but totally reject christian mythology, I'm sorry I didn't know the Black Pope. I think we would have been good friends. Personally, I don't care what anyone believes in. I only care about what I believe in. I also don't care where anyone is going after they die, for all we ever have is what's going on right now, in this present moment. However, if any of y'all come looking for me after we're dead I'll usually be in that part of the Summerland where AC/DC, Judas Priest, and Black Sabbath among other unholy choirs of fallen angels will be playing live throughout eternity! As an inter faith minister I don't minister I don't minister to others in accordance with my beliefs, but theirs.
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Carl Elfstrom
If you don't find me listening to, and partying with those unholy choirs in the Summer land after death, don't worry, for I shall return. We can check out any time we like, but we can never leave. And who would ever want to? Still, Cerberus will be waiting at the gate , to lead them home, just in case.
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Hoggdogg
All atheist belive in 1 thing they donot know what they belive and people say there no god well . I dont care its your wright . If there no god how do you think the titanic sank the owner said god him selfe cant sink this ship so if you dont belive in god . Like i said its your wright but when you die you go to heaven or hell .read about SATAN do you realy want to go there. Gods peace too al
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Amber
No, it isn't dangerous. Atheists just do not believe in deity or the theology that directly connects to it. The only thing they are dangerous to would be zealots who haven't researched how religions in general and Christianity specifically were developed. I have yet to meet an atheist who was not kind, intelligent, and truly concerned about the welfare of people.
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john shephard
Atheists are fine. It is just another form of ignorance and they deserve to be left alone to work out any questions they have about the existence and nature of God for themselves. Religion has nothing to do with God per se. It is the creation of people. Those who find religion unworthy or unappealing for whatever reason often mistakenly think they have justification for denying the existence of God. If their declaration of Atheism is based on their rejection of religion they have reasoned falsely. It is a mistake based on shallow reasoning. I rejected most of religion a long time ago, partly in order to embrace God more directly. Though we may discuss them, each of us must be resepctfully allowed to figure out these issues for ourselves. Whatever we conclude does not faze God. The truth is the truth and ignorance is forgiven. There are always more lifetimes until one gets it right.
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Alin Steglinski
I dont identify as atheist but I am not a textbook Christian. I am a sinful Christian that doesnt believe the Bible is the current story. Its out of date and useless here on earth since earth is not where God is but is where his Holy Spirit is. Thusly that means we are technically in purgatory or hell. I believe in only one thing, theres something bigger than us that loves us unconditionally named God. Thats all.
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Christian
Atheist = ( monotheist -1 )
If you are a monotheist, you are already mostly atheist, except 1.
So you believe Thor, Odin, Ra, Zeus, Mars, and all the rest are 'Fake gods' or dead gods. ok...
R i g h t . . . because You have the ONE TRUE GOD ! Is that correct ?
What is the name of this deity you seem so interested in ?
Why are you interested in this deity?
How did you meet this deity ?
Where does your deity live ?
Who does your deity help ?
When has this deity helped you, specifically ?
How much do you really love this particular deity, the very last one you believe exists ?
As far as I know, the only deity that answers all questions is LOVE.
If you know something even better than real, true, creative Love - please tell us!
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ligiafortes
And there it is, leave it to you and Ann Coulter to blame liberals for the shooting. It must be the Godlessness and the lack of family values along with liberal entitlement that engendered the soft approach toward bad behavior. Look, you"re going to lose your guns. Sorry to say it but two things are for sure marijuana will be legal everywhere in the U.S. and you are going to lose some of your gun rights. Bummer right? Now what? Oh, also, some Americans have learned a little lesson from this whole Trump experiment. Expect progress.
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Maurice Slaunwhite
Banding religion does not mean that a person does not believe in God. In fact God has nothing to do with religion in the first place. The Bible does not say that religion is about the Lord. The Lord is about the Trinity, Father,Son and Holy Spirit and definitely not about Religion and remember that. In Heaven there is no religion. Religion is man made which has a name of each group of people which is no Better than any other people or persons. In Gods eyes every person is equal and made in his image. No person is better than the other God just wants every person to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. In John 3:16 it says For God so loved the world that he gave his only Begotten Son and who soever believeth in him will not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:17 God sent not his son into the world to Condemn the world but that the world through him might be saved.Remember to believe in the Lord Jesus and you shall be saved. Remember God loves you and may you have the joy of the Lord. Laugh at Satan and he will leave and you will be well from the Lord. In The Name of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God may peace be with you now and always. God bless you all. It doesn't matter what religion you are. It is not about religion but the Lord himself always remember that forever and ever and ever. God loves you Forever. Those who believe. God bless you all.
I am unsure why religion (or lack of) is such a huge deal anywhere. We are a nation of constitutional law, NOT religious law. Some folks, unfortunately, really don't get that. I wonder what ever happened to "religion is a personal thing"???
I agree with you to a point. God always gave us free freedom of choice. If you choose not to believe in God I do not condemn you or whoever. It’s the atheist that want to take the rights of the Christians away from them and push things on them/Christians that’s against their Christian ethics upsets me. Not all atheists are radicals as well as Christians. It’s a personal choice and I choose to be Christian and I believe in God/Jesus and the Holy Spirit. But I do get railed up on someone says you have to make me a cake just because we know you don’t want to. They’re causing hate and discontent because there’s always someone out there that will make a nice cake. If you asked somebody to do something that they really don’t want to do you’re not getting their best so why do you want to use them. It’s only because you want to raise hate and discontent but they won’t go to a Muslim bakery and do the same. This is why I get upset with the atheist but most atheists are not going to push something on us anymore then we’re going to put something on them. Because God said I give you free choice but your free choice does it mean that you can say we can’t believe and have our thoughts about our Lord. And if it would stay neutral I could handle it but it’s the one to go overboard and that means both ways. Yes I would love to see everyone saved and go to heaven life just doesn’t work that way so I am not going to push somebody to the point of if you don’t want to know my lord it’s OK because God said it was OK. But he also said he loves everyone. I am a chapel
I think you're confusing two different issues: being gay and being an atheist. The two gay gentlemen wanting a baker to bake them a cake did not want a radical Christian to discriminate against them because they were gay. It wasn't an issue that he was Christian, but that he was a Christian being unreasonable and treating them differently than a non-gay couple. Atheism didn't enter into it. According to legend, did Christ condemn Mary Magdalene? The baker's actions seem hypocritical to me.
Just a point-- Christ told her He didn't condemn her, but also told her to change her way of life: "...Neither do I condemn thee. Go, and sin no more."